Moonstone Units

[dead pirate gamer]

What units do you prefer to have your Moonstone character? I have never used the item before. I have a 2400 point list i plan to try out this week with Glade Lord on a Great Stag carrying the Moonstone in a unit of Wild Riders. I have the Acorn in the list too. The idea is to bounce them around to set up flank/rear charges as well as scare people into over reacting.

[Phil Rossiter]

I've tried Stag Lord in Wild Riders and I'm not convinced. On the charge, they don't need him, otherwise he's not enough to win a grind for them. Sisters make more sense for a bus IMHO because they are more resilient, you don't lose control due to Frenzy and they can heal the characters.

As far as Stag Lord goes, he needs Charmed Shield IMHO else war machines kill him. That means he pretty much has to take a 4+ Ward for general defence. That leaves 50pts, best spent on Ogre Blade I believe. You could get away with Moonstone and Great Weapon but he fights worse.

Acorns then have to go on a mage. A further mage is then a very good idea to carry Dispel Scroll. BSB is a good idea generally.

[NonnoSte]

With no much surprise, I found the moonstone effective on a Shadoweaver sitting in a decent sized unit of Scouts or Waywatchers (20 in the last game I tried it).
Being skirmishers they can teleport and keep on shooting as usual.
Probably Trueflight is better than Hagbane in this specific situation.

Otherwise a Dark or Death Weaver can make good use of that item, sending vortexes up enemy's flanks.

[Phil Rossiter]

I use Beasts lvl4 in Waywatchers, very happy with it.

Moonstone sets the spells up beautifully and is very good for keeping them out of harm's way.

Globally, Moonstone is great because it increases the flexibility and threat of an already fluid army. Compared to other elves you could say we got the worst magic items but Moonstone is a peach.

[Aezeal]

I'm not really convinced about moonstone myself so I've never used it. More importantly I've not seen a battle report in here where it seems it was worth it's points.
The fact you can't charge or shoot after you teleport (I'm right on that I hope, no book here) means an important unit will not be doing something 1/6 of the game. If only the acorn as a bit cheaper (a bit MUCH cheaper) then I could see more options. WIth only 1 forest you can tactically place the position of the other forest(s) are a bit too... random for me to take an item for. IMHO the acorn should have the moonstone ability in it.. for 100 points total I think it would be a nice item. Not to mention that in Eternal King army (with the sweet rerolls on melee) you won't even have that 1 forest.

[Phil Rossiter]

The Moonstoning unit counts as marching, so Skirmishers can still shoot. This is why we recommended using these Aezeal. You do need at least two woods on the table to use it properly though.

First game with it, I moonstoned last turn and flank shotted a unit of three Ogres (had been nine) with Amber Spear. Two dead, Waywatchers got the last guy. That was a lot of points. This was at the Pompey Pillage, detailed on page four of my blog, linked in my sig.

[tomrobo23]

I use the moonstone in virtually every list. One of our best items imho.

I generally put it on the BSB or a lvl4 (i generally run two). pretty much exclusively on foot models though as i haven't needed the manoeuvrability on the fast cav options as they are about the best thing in the game in that respect already. My general plan is a screen of wardancers in my wood with the trueflight glade guard bunker behind shooting through. gets me cover bonuses, (hard cover on GG, soft +skirmish on WarD's) +1 to cast, and gives my opponent something to aim his army at (essentially giving me the initiative as i can pick off units then while the bunker remains safe.

Very little can blow through 10 wardancers, their champ and with the BSB sat behind with rerolls while they safety dance (3++)in their poisoned wood. Things get hairy the moonstone comes in and the only valuable static element of the army, the thing your opponent will go for, can teleport to safety something easy to achieve with some warhawks and wildriders to clear out avenues. Other element in this is i run high/shadow magic so can throw out big okhams and such on the dancers in a suicide pact with whatever big nasty unit managed to reach your backfield. Works very consistently and should you lose the dancers, it's only 160 pts and they're a very versatile unit.

Another aspect is using the moonstone offensively. I've stuck my BSB in the wardancers and moonstoned up the field to get on opponent's flanks before, while risky they become a threat that an opponent must react to, forcing difficult decisions and concessions on your opponent gives us the initiative to dominate his movement and controlling board space wins us games. I don't do this often as i don't take a moonstone caddy so it's on valuable characters but it singlehandedly turned a 20-0 defeat to a 20-0 win when some appalling luck had me set to lose so i threw caution out the window and sent my wardancers to confront a dark elf cold one cav bus with my BSB. I cut him off with an eagle then flank charged him with the dancers while sitting on the edge of a wood. I killed them all through weight of attacks and KB until Wildriders could show up to murder the last 6 or 7, took out a BSB, master and sorceress with the knights and buckled his centre.

Honestly i think stag riders are a fun but pointless choice, they're never worth their cost compared to wildriders and when going in wildrider units they don't prove their offensive worth for cost and the unit loses its fast cav ability, including vanguard. you can mitigate this with the stone but to fit the unit in with the width you want for max attacks means you have to be careful, obviously you lose unlimited reforms and have to fit wholly inside a wood and depending on where you play the terrain may not support this (thinking of north west gaming centre in the UK for example with the thin strips of forest terrain)

[Syphilis]

This maybe a silly question. Do Deepwood Scouts or Waywatchers lose their Scouting ability if you put a (Moostoning) Spellweaver with them? Or is this not allowed in deployment?

[Git]

A character without the Scout rule cannot be deployed as a Scout.

[Aezeal]

I can see it could get some awesome plays but I'm just wondering how often that will be the case? Maybe I'll try it myself, in my store they don't object to placing 3 forest on the table BEFORE my own forest.. so that should give me plenty of opporunity. There is a moral problem though.. I could place those forest very strategically when I know I'm bringing the moonstone.

[dead pirate gamer]

I will rethink the use. I have never run a Stag before and forgot that WRs lose fast cav when it joins the unit.

[Phil Rossiter]

I take Tom's point about woods available. To be honest Aezeal, all you need are two medium-sized woods on the table, location not that crucial. Maybe just put them symetrically diagonal. This is what I usually find pre-set at tournaments. You place your free wood to create tactical opportunities with the other two.

Wild Riders are great and I would always take some but they have limits. They can only fight on the charge, which with the multiple tanks now flying around, is not always enough. A Frostheart or WoC hero for example will stop them cold, unless you get a serious buff off, which largely depends on having drawn the scroll. Plus they can't Flee.

A cavalry bus on the other hand, can be pushed forwards into charge zones where WR's can't, making better use of the speed it has. It can fight and win grinding combats. Whether this is an effective strategy for Wood Elves is not clear, it hasn't had enough testing. The basic version, as run by Astorre, has fighting Lord plus BSB in Sisters with Razor standard (unlike Warlocks)and a High mage. The Protection Counters make it very difficult to put active combat res on.

The point of a Great Stag here, is that Sisters, while a great combat bus unit (I'd figured this out on first read of the book) don't kill much. The Stag adds Impact Hits, Stomp and two S5 (AP) attacks. He also makes the Lord immune to KB, S5 vs Dwellers and T4. This last is not the end when you have Beasts and Life, it's just the start. This guy is better at fighting challenges. Yes you lose Vanguard but that's hit and miss, it's often dependent on winning the Scouts roll-off. Losing 18" with unlimited reforms hurts more. But at the end of the day, the unit remains M9/Swiftstride with a musician (unlike Warlocks) for Swift Reforms. Not too shabby. Though quite honestly, the thinking required to use this guy makes him more nerve-wracking than fun!

Again, Tom's point about flexible use of Moonstone is a good one. While I usually keep mine in Waywatchers, there's nothing to stop me moving him and two other characters into my Eternal Guard at any point and teleporting the lot behind enemy lines. You don't have to telegraph this at all and the elements can start 20" apart. Storm from a clear sky.

[tomrobo23]

yeah i used the moonstoning eternal guard star at Bjorn 4 in the UK. Nice little unit.



one example right there, empire misdeployed and turn one i moonstone up to isolate his left flank with the EG star on the right

[UKlvrBM]

I use the moonstone in my army sometimes. I generally have a large block of trueflight archers sitting back in a forest. Generally, that is the only unit that is stationary. As such, it is a nice target for someone to rush forward and to try and take out. Otherwise, I get to pepper them with arrows every turn. If they get close enough to charge, I moonstone away to another forest. All you need is two on the table and to know that you need to stay away from the other one enough that your opponent won't be in position to charge them once they teleport.

This works amazingly when you have units of wild riders, sisters, warhawks, scouts and waywatchers on your flanks because it is the only central and slow target in my army.

[Shifte]

Spellsinger: Moonstone
17 Deepwood Scouts, Trueflight

3 ranks of 6. I think that can fit in easily enough.

My friends and I play by the "d6+4 pieces of terrain" rules from the rulebook, with each of us placing terrain pieces consecutively. That means that at the very LEAST I can guarantee 2 forests. At best I can ensure that there are at least 5.

[Aezeal]

Personally I think that is how WH should be played. The movement penalties have been removed from forests etc so no reason not to scatter forests and other terrain all over the map... that is the reason such a rule is in the rulebook.
I think everyone should insist that is how the game is meant to be played.