Viability of Wood Elf Light Council

[FriedTaterExplosion]

How do you think something along these lines would do?

Wood Elf Light Council – 2500 points

Weaver
Lore of Light-Level 4
Elven Steed
Forbidden Rod
Talisman of Preservation

Singer
Lore of Light- Level 1
Elven Steed
Power Stone

Singer
Lore of Light- Level 1
Elven Steed
Channeling Staff

Singer
Lore of Light- Level 1
Elven Steed
Dispel Scroll

10 Glade Guard
Trueflight Arrows
Musician

10 Glade Guard
Star Fire Arrows
Musician

19 Glade Guard
Trueflight Arrows
Musician and Standard

10 Sisters of the Thorn
Standard with Gleaming pennant

7 Wild Riders
Shields
Banner of Eternal Flame

7 Wild Riders
Shields
Standard

7 Wild Riders
Shields
Standard

Great Eagle

Great Eagle

5 Waywatchers

5 Waywatchers

I guess the question for you, is what besides the light mages would you tweak in this?

Anybody think the light council just ain't viable for us?

[kakwah]

If I'm running a light council I'd run a brick of wwr.

[Phil Rossiter]

Bogi of this forum was top WE at the ETC with a coven.

Main difference was he had mainly GR's in Core not archers. If you've got lots of archers I agree with kakwah.

[astorre]

Sounds crazy but id drop the Wild Riders and take scouts. Run around and cast Shems, Banishment, Phas, and Net. Anything your arrows can't take down, Banish.

[Ember of the Hidden Paths]

I play against Undead legions pretty much every week now, and so have been running a light council every game almost.
The one bit of advice I would give above all others, that exists regardless of the rest of your list, is give ONE of your spellsingers LVL 2. Whatever spells you roll for him, keep the worse of the two and swap the other for shem's. This way, rather than having a 1/10 chance (roughly) of not getting banishment on your level 4, you have a 1/1200 ish chance. Well worth the points. I played a game where I didn't get banish once. The light council just isn't the same without it.

Furthermore an alternative is to run them all on foot and give one of the mages the moonstone. This is because if you stick them in a wood, you can 1 dice shem's burning gaze on all the little mages and have a 1/3 change of getting it off. My magic phase consequently usually looks like:
1 dice shem lvl 1
1 dice shem lvl 1
1 dice shem lvl 2
X dice Banishment lvl 4 (X= how badly I want it off. X>3)
1 Dice Shem lvl 4

[bjoernuhlig]

agree with the lvl2 upgrade. and dont stick the rod on your lvl4. fluff your dice once and your game is over. stickem on a lvl 1 and still get to keep banishment at 7, at 6 if the rod kills one of your 1ers. leaves room for another more useful item.

[Phil Rossiter]

Coven players tend be very precise on their magic phases!

I remember Brewmaster's old thread on Ulthuan. He did a lot of magic dice analysis.

[FriedTaterExplosion]

agree with the lvl2 upgrade. and dont stick the rod on your lvl4. fluff your dice once and your game is over. stickem on a lvl 1 and still get to keep banishment at 7, at 6 if the rod kills one of your 1ers. leaves room for another more useful item.

I have some dice by my desk and I've rolled the chances of my level 4 (who has a 4++ ward save) killing themselves from the forbidden rod. It's actually a fairly low chance of her dying outright. The sisters lore of life attribute can restore wounds on her if she takes 1 or 2. I think the chances of her rolling three wounds and failing all three ward saves is very small.

[FriedTaterExplosion]

And here is Bogi's ETC Light Council List. It just looks brilliant.

Team Serbia

Bogdan Obradović, Wood Elves
Spellweaver: General, Lvl 4, Light, Elven Steed, Moonstone of the Hidden Ways,Talisman of Presevation, Scroll of Shielding, 340
Glade Captain: BSB, Elven Steed, Asrai Longbow, Light Armor, Great Weapon, Hail of Doom Arrow, Charmed Shield, 149
Spellsinger: Lvl 1, Light, Elven Steed, Obsidian Amulet, 120
Spellsinger: Lvl 1, Light, Elven Steed, Dispel Scroll, 115
Spellsinger: Lvl 1, Light, Elven Steed, 90
12 Glade Riders: Trueflight Arrows, Standard, Gleaming Pendant, 279
3x 5 Glade Riders: Trueflight Arrows, 3x 110
9 Sisters of the Thorn: Musician, Standard, Standard of Discipline, 269
7 Wild Riders: Shields, Standard, Banner of Eternal Flame, 216
2x 7 Wild Riders: Shields, 2x 196
2x Great Eagle, 2x 50
Total: 2400

[Phil Rossiter]

Hmm.

I thought you would only make a single Ward save and then roll a D3 per pg 45 but the item description does refer to "no armour saves" in the plural.

[wisetiger7]

Hmm.

I thought you would only make a single Ward save and then roll a D3 per pg 45 but the item description does refer to "no armour saves" in the plural.

+1

[NonnoSte]

Why no Earthing Rod on the L4?
A bad miscast could really ruin the game.

[Phil Rossiter]

She can 1/2/3 dice all the spells. Looks like a decent shout though.

I guess it would mean cutting the Ward to a 5+.

[NonnoSte]

She can 1/2/3 dice all the spells. Looks like a decent shout though.

I guess it would mean cutting the Ward to a 5+.

I guess you're unfamiliar with miscasts on the first 2-diced spell of the game.
I usually manage to do that when attempting a Miasma or an Harmonic Convergence to draw dice.

[Phil Rossiter]

I guess Bogi thought the odds were OK. The list did pretty well for him.

[FriedTaterExplosion]

I guess Bogi thought the odds were OK. The list did pretty well for him.

One thing that is interesting, is level 1 Wood Elf casters only need a 3+ to cast Shem's (if they are in a woods.) You have 3 or so level 1 casters, I think it's a good idea to simply single dice Shems. With four level ones you should have 2-3 successful castings of Shem's- with no risk of miscast.

No other race's level 1s can single dice Shem's with our effectiveness, I'd argue.

[Rafiki]

Has anyone thought to use Calaingor's stave in a light council?

Pro's:
2D6 Hits so could benefit from the lore attribute and get +1D6
Has an Ultimate that hits all forest within 12"
cast on 8+ or for ultimate 16+
Can be cast with one dice from a lvl 4 in a forest
You can move a venomous forest in front of a big unit to control movement
Ultimate can move all forest within 12" around
Is an augment spell... you can cast it into combat
only 20 points

Con's
Only range 18"
Enemy unit needs to touch the/a forest
Ultimate range only 12"
Ultimate still str 4
Need acorns of the ages for craziness?
Only one enemy unit per forest
Is an arcane item
Generates one less spell

Would love to discuss this before i test it out with a light council

[Phil Rossiter]

I love this item, I just can't fit it into my list. But a Coven is spoiled for Arcane slots. Worth a try I believe.

Tree Singing has no Attribute. It is Wood Elf magic!

[sunstrider]

I love this item, I just can't fit it into my list. But a Coven is spoiled for Arcane slots. Worth a try I believe.

Tree Singing has no Attribute. It is Wood Elf magic!

It's an interesting way to include the stave, which most people choose to ignore, but if it goes on anyone, it shouldn't go on a level 1. Everyone at least needs Shem's in my opinion, so that leaves the level 4 or a level 2. And paying for a second level just to get Shem's + Stave doesn't sound like a wise investment

[Phil Rossiter]

Hmm, I'd say priorities for Coven mages are:

1) Up strength of Banishment
2) Improve lvl4's spell selection
3) Carry Arcane Item

So yeah, I'd definitely make it a lvl2 here, he has to know a Light spell to qualify for 1) above which the Stave removes if he's level 1. I agree though, is the Stave worth it at all? Maybe combined with Moonstone and/or Acorns.

A 'normal' list with two mages could afford to use the second Arcane slot on the Stave (first goes to Dispel Scroll IMHO).

[Rafiki]

I love this item, I just can't fit it into my list. But a Coven is spoiled for Arcane slots. Worth a try I believe.

Tree Singing has no Attribute. It is Wood Elf magic!

So how does the spell function in regard to attributes, all new spells have lore attributes, even the sisters two spell function with attributes.
treesinging has no lore attribute noted in our book, so since it more or less replaced one of the spells the weaver/singer would otherwise know, i assumed it would gain the lore attribute from the lore that the weaver/singer knows. Since a weaver/singer would only "know" spells from his or her lore unless it was a "bound" spell like ring of ruby fire.

That is also the reason why didnt think about a lvl 1. My assumption was that treesinging became part of whatever lore the weaver/singer has selected

[Phil Rossiter]

It could be argued that way, I just disagree. Page 163 states "Some" lores have an attribute. It also states that Attributes only apply to spells from that Lore. I'm not sure that Tree Singing becomes a Light spell.

On the plus side, it would give the extra hits. On the minus side, this is the only spell in the game unique to us anymore, flavour is important!

[Rafiki]

The whole "some" lores have attributes is just a way for them to excuse, that the old army books didnt get an errata that gave their unique lore's attributes.
so they could wait and just write it into their respective new 8th edition army book.

[Phil Rossiter]

But now we're into RAI vs RAW.

Best to simply agree it beforehand with opponent, gaming group or TO I suggest.

[NonnoSte]

Don't Vampire Counts have something similar in their book?
Lizardmen too have Lord Kroak's own spell with no attribute.