Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Moderator: Council of Elders
-
- Trusted Bowman
- Posts: 111
- Joined: 08 Jun 2011, 20:24
Are the Bretton's our pawns?
There is much debate over this, it is cleat the Asrai have some influence on Bretton development but are they our pawns? Is Ariel really the lady of the lake or is she some different deitiy that is tyed to the land of brettonia itself?
My main pont i base this quesion on is that in our book, on the timeline it says "The Fey Enchantress us appointed to oversee the Brettonians." Is the Fey Enchantress not the pope of the Bretton religion and if we appointed her, as in she is a servant of Ariel does that not mean we made up there whole religion? I have not read knight of the grail but i heard there are some answers there. Can anyone clarify this for me, because when i was having a look at the round table forum they where all saying that we did not have any influence on them, but do we?
My main pont i base this quesion on is that in our book, on the timeline it says "The Fey Enchantress us appointed to oversee the Brettonians." Is the Fey Enchantress not the pope of the Bretton religion and if we appointed her, as in she is a servant of Ariel does that not mean we made up there whole religion? I have not read knight of the grail but i heard there are some answers there. Can anyone clarify this for me, because when i was having a look at the round table forum they where all saying that we did not have any influence on them, but do we?
- dusk1983
- Bladesinger
- Posts: 875
- Joined: 27 Jun 2010, 10:46
- Armies I play: Tyranids, Tau, Blood Angels and Wood Elves
- Location: brisbane australia
- Contact:
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
If you read the Brettonian book and the wood elf book in tandum one of the most interesting correlation is thus:
Brettonia pg 47
"for every child that shows signs of such mystical powers, there are other 'gifted' children that never display any outward sign of their strange, otherworld traits... Before they reach puberty, almost all children with these strange talents are visited by the Fay Enchantress. She takes them with her to the otherworld, and they are mourned by their parents as if they were no longer living... While nothing is ever seen of the boy children again, sometimes the girl children will..."
Wood Elves pg 5
"Boy children taken from the lands around the forest, destined never to grow old, joyfully serve their graceful Elven masters"
Coincidence? Maybe. This has always been the big connection for me.
Gilles the uniter and his companion met the lady of the lake in the forest of Chalons which is in the province of Quinelles (borders on Athel Loren).
Whilst I don't believe the brettonians to be 100% at the mercy of wood elven masters, it appears that the lady is indeed Ariel or at least a powerful Asrai caster, and their development as a culture has been crafted by the Asrai to form a bit of a symbiotic relationship. The easily scared and superstitious Brettonians are a much better neighbour than the rampaging orcs that occupied those lands before them. And the belief in the Lady and therefore the power bestowed upon the Fey Enchantress is there to keep the most powerful members of the Brettonian race (mages) on either a short leash or perpetual youthful servitude in the case of the little boys. (which i find a bit creepy. Why keep only the boys?)
Also Fey Enchantress Profile is Movement 5. She is not human. The profile definately looks Elfish.
EDIT: Upon further research, I've got a bit more evidence: Brettonian Lore states that Unicorns dwell within the mysterious otherworld(In the section for the fey enchantress). We all know that unicorns are in fact of magical creature of Athel Loren as their entry in our army book states. But the otherworld is where the Fay enchantress takes her little boys and girls as stated in my uote above. So maybe the otherworld... is... athel loren? (When you read this, please read it with my voice rasing as the sentence continues and me putting my pinky to my mouth just like Doctor Evil)
Brettonia pg 47
"for every child that shows signs of such mystical powers, there are other 'gifted' children that never display any outward sign of their strange, otherworld traits... Before they reach puberty, almost all children with these strange talents are visited by the Fay Enchantress. She takes them with her to the otherworld, and they are mourned by their parents as if they were no longer living... While nothing is ever seen of the boy children again, sometimes the girl children will..."
Wood Elves pg 5
"Boy children taken from the lands around the forest, destined never to grow old, joyfully serve their graceful Elven masters"
Coincidence? Maybe. This has always been the big connection for me.
Gilles the uniter and his companion met the lady of the lake in the forest of Chalons which is in the province of Quinelles (borders on Athel Loren).
Whilst I don't believe the brettonians to be 100% at the mercy of wood elven masters, it appears that the lady is indeed Ariel or at least a powerful Asrai caster, and their development as a culture has been crafted by the Asrai to form a bit of a symbiotic relationship. The easily scared and superstitious Brettonians are a much better neighbour than the rampaging orcs that occupied those lands before them. And the belief in the Lady and therefore the power bestowed upon the Fey Enchantress is there to keep the most powerful members of the Brettonian race (mages) on either a short leash or perpetual youthful servitude in the case of the little boys. (which i find a bit creepy. Why keep only the boys?)
Also Fey Enchantress Profile is Movement 5. She is not human. The profile definately looks Elfish.
EDIT: Upon further research, I've got a bit more evidence: Brettonian Lore states that Unicorns dwell within the mysterious otherworld(In the section for the fey enchantress). We all know that unicorns are in fact of magical creature of Athel Loren as their entry in our army book states. But the otherworld is where the Fay enchantress takes her little boys and girls as stated in my uote above. So maybe the otherworld... is... athel loren? (When you read this, please read it with my voice rasing as the sentence continues and me putting my pinky to my mouth just like Doctor Evil)
...So if you're addressing me direct, just call me Lance or Dusk, no 1983 please.
Chaos dwarf tactica: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=23535
Chaos dwarf plog: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=23159
Chaos dwarf tactica: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=23535
Chaos dwarf plog: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=23159
- Ravenlord
- Horsemaster
- Posts: 331
- Joined: 27 Jun 2011, 11:43
- Armies I play: Wood elfs, Eldar and I own an unplayed small High elf host
- Location: Southern Sweden
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
You Sir, know your fluff. Very nice read too, I might ad.
It´s really cool to have something written here.
- Billthesurly
- Elder of the Council
- Posts: 1324
- Joined: 20 Jan 2012, 14:31
- Armies I play: Wood Elves, Orcs and Amazons
- Location: Baton Rouge, Louisiana, Ministry of Profound Bloviation.
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Of COURSE they are! They bees our bitches. We've been leading those ignorant and superstitious humans around by the nose forever. We made up their religion for them and serve as their dieties. High level spellweavers take turns showing up as "The Fay Enchantress". They have archery contests to see who has to go and be the Lady of the Lake this month. We set up their entire culture to be a bulwark against nasty things on our northern border. They are deferential, brave, obedient, loyal, honest, trustworthy - everything you want in a guard dog. Their culture is not too advanced so we don't have to put up with soot and smoke belching, steam powered mills and factories like they have in the Empire or that those tree-murdering Dwarves love so much. We have convinced their nobility that black powder weapons are not chivalrous and dis-honorable so we don't have lots of loud noise disturbing our glades. Who could ask for better neighbors?
The above is not necessarilly cannon. It is the viewpoint of MY Welf's "Arafel's Exiles" and is simply what the books hint at taken to extremes. It is intended to be mostly humorous so please, no letter bombs from Brettonian players unless delivered in the same vien.
The above is not necessarilly cannon. It is the viewpoint of MY Welf's "Arafel's Exiles" and is simply what the books hint at taken to extremes. It is intended to be mostly humorous so please, no letter bombs from Brettonian players unless delivered in the same vien.
So it's no longer the BRB, now it's the DERB. (Digital Edition Rule Book) I am all in for 9th Age.
- Ravenlord
- Horsemaster
- Posts: 331
- Joined: 27 Jun 2011, 11:43
- Armies I play: Wood elfs, Eldar and I own an unplayed small High elf host
- Location: Southern Sweden
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Extremism is an excellent way to prove a point.
It´s really cool to have something written here.
- Beithir Seun
- The Philosopher
- Posts: 17411
- Joined: 18 Apr 2006, 18:03
- Armies I play: Wood Elves, Bretonnians | Sylvaneth, Soulblight Gravelords | Astra Militarum, Tau
- Location: Staffordshire, UK
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Not canonical, but the WFRP book Knights of the Grail states outright that the Fey Enchantress is an elf. I seem to remember somewhere else (maybe also in Knights of the Grail or possibly Guardians of the Forest) hinting that the Fey Enchantress and Naieth the Prophetess are the same person as well.
Carrot and Stick ~ Beithir's Blog
- Ethankyou
- Newcomer
- Posts: 39
- Joined: 26 Jun 2012, 18:16
- Armies I play: Wood Elves, Tyranids
- Location: Halifax, NS
- Contact:
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
This is an awesome fluff-extrapolation!
I think the official answer would be "...Sure!"
My official answer would be "...Cool!"
I think the official answer would be "...Sure!"
My official answer would be "...Cool!"
Look me in the eye and tell me. Who's story do you think this is!?
- dusk1983
- Bladesinger
- Posts: 875
- Joined: 27 Jun 2010, 10:46
- Armies I play: Tyranids, Tau, Blood Angels and Wood Elves
- Location: brisbane australia
- Contact:
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
thanks for the compliment. In all honesty though, I was avoiding doing an assignment and I saw this post. "Aha!" thought I to myself. "A thin excuse to procrastinate!" and then i pulled out both books and did some fact checking from what I'd thought I'd read in the past.Ravenlord wrote:You Sir, know your fluff. Very nice read too, I might ad.
...So if you're addressing me direct, just call me Lance or Dusk, no 1983 please.
Chaos dwarf tactica: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=23535
Chaos dwarf plog: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=23159
Chaos dwarf tactica: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=23535
Chaos dwarf plog: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=23159
- Ravenlord
- Horsemaster
- Posts: 331
- Joined: 27 Jun 2011, 11:43
- Armies I play: Wood elfs, Eldar and I own an unplayed small High elf host
- Location: Southern Sweden
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Slacking like a Sir
It´s really cool to have something written here.
-
- Newcomer
- Posts: 8
- Joined: 27 Jun 2012, 21:57
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Ok, regarding this kind of thinking.dusk1983 wrote: (which i find a bit creepy. Why keep only the boys?)
We as a society aren't geared towards the thinking that was prevalent a century ago. A century ago, children were innocent and beautiful little people and were basically adored for their looks and manners in a completely NON-sexual way.
So that is what i think the elves took them for, because having children serve them for eternity, laughing, playing games and basically being childlike amuses the elves.
Just my 2 cents
- dusk1983
- Bladesinger
- Posts: 875
- Joined: 27 Jun 2010, 10:46
- Armies I play: Tyranids, Tau, Blood Angels and Wood Elves
- Location: brisbane australia
- Contact:
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
no i get all of that and would understand entirely, if they kept the best and brightest children to be their servants rather than just the boys. Little girls are just as vibrant and energetic as little boys.
From a fluff standpoint perhaps the Male spellcasters are more difficult to control and manipulate when they grow up compared to the girls who become the damsels of the lady. In which case the boys are kept as servants because the Asrai can't afford to let them grow up, but can't bring themselves to kill them. Which all in all is a lot nicer.
From a fluff standpoint perhaps the Male spellcasters are more difficult to control and manipulate when they grow up compared to the girls who become the damsels of the lady. In which case the boys are kept as servants because the Asrai can't afford to let them grow up, but can't bring themselves to kill them. Which all in all is a lot nicer.
...So if you're addressing me direct, just call me Lance or Dusk, no 1983 please.
Chaos dwarf tactica: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=23535
Chaos dwarf plog: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=23159
Chaos dwarf tactica: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=23535
Chaos dwarf plog: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=23159
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Maybe they rip out their hearts and turn them into slaves of athel loren. Darker and moe sinister but that's how I like my woodies, none of this, "fairies and sunshine," stuff.
Last edited by Moose123 on 16 Jul 2012, 17:42, edited 1 time in total.
But here, cleverly disguised as a bomb, is a bomb.
-Bullwinkle
If you keep saying things are going to be bad, you have a good chance of being a prophet.
-Isaac Bashevis Singer
-Bullwinkle
If you keep saying things are going to be bad, you have a good chance of being a prophet.
-Isaac Bashevis Singer
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Hey fairies are dark as heck in old time legends. Let's be fairies.
My dream for 8th ed Wood Elves: Less need to use Trees, elves get better, less need for me to have a Lord Mage. Not the most realistic, but hey we've got to have wishlists eh?
ALL HAIL TREE MAMMOTH!
ALL HAIL TREE MAMMOTH!
- Revelen
- Horsemaster
- Posts: 259
- Joined: 18 Feb 2013, 07:44
- Armies I play: Wood Elves, High Elves
- Location: Brunswick, Maine, USA
- Contact:
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
I just snorted tea up the back of my nose and got a bizarre look from my girlfriend. Thanks.Billthesurly wrote:They have archery contests to see who has to go and be the Lady of the Lake this month.
- Billthesurly
- Elder of the Council
- Posts: 1324
- Joined: 20 Jan 2012, 14:31
- Armies I play: Wood Elves, Orcs and Amazons
- Location: Baton Rouge, Louisiana, Ministry of Profound Bloviation.
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Don't mention it.
So it's no longer the BRB, now it's the DERB. (Digital Edition Rule Book) I am all in for 9th Age.
- Baardah
- Former Council Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: 25 Aug 2009, 23:01
- Armies I play: WE, Dwarf, HE, Skaven, VC, O&G
- Location: Norway, upon the North Pole
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
But if the enchantress can use any lore of the book and is a spell weaver, why can't our casters use those lores too?
My summer night wood elves
Drstrangelove wrote:Imagine a magic item. For 20 points you get +4M, Vanguard, extra +1 to your armour save, unlimited free reforms, and an extra S3 attack at I4.
That item would be in every list.
That item is a horse...
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Because she is better!!!
But here, cleverly disguised as a bomb, is a bomb.
-Bullwinkle
If you keep saying things are going to be bad, you have a good chance of being a prophet.
-Isaac Bashevis Singer
-Bullwinkle
If you keep saying things are going to be bad, you have a good chance of being a prophet.
-Isaac Bashevis Singer
- Lain
- Newcomer
- Posts: 52
- Joined: 28 Dec 2009, 20:13
- Armies I play: Forest Spirits
- Location: Athel Loren
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
The armylist we had when the rules for her were written allowed us to use all BRB lores with our L3+4 Casters.
I bet she will be limited to life and beasts when they get a new book.
I bet she will be limited to life and beasts when they get a new book.
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
LOL thanks for bumping this post.Revelen wrote:I just snorted tea up the back of my nose and got a bizarre look from my girlfriend. Thanks.Billthesurly wrote:They have archery contests to see who has to go and be the Lady of the Lake this month.
I'm a Bretonnian player myself, and I enjoyed this immensely.
- Jossebuschman
- Trusted Bowman
- Posts: 165
- Joined: 04 Jun 2013, 21:27
- Armies I play: Wood elves, Bretonnians, Romans, Greeks, Vikings, CoA.
- Location: Amsterdam, the Netherlands
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Me too, I really hope the allies rules I have been reading so much speculation about will be in the new book.
Besides having awesome fluff synergy, they also work very well together ruleswise.
Maybe the fey enchantress will get lore of athel loren as well?!?
Besides having awesome fluff synergy, they also work very well together ruleswise.
Maybe the fey enchantress will get lore of athel loren as well?!?
Now there's a frood who knows where his towel is!
- Manit0u
- Newcomer
- Posts: 47
- Joined: 06 Jun 2013, 08:45
- Armies I play: Wood Elves, Dark Elves
- Location: Lublin, Poland
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Personally I think it's a Peter Pan homage :)Highborn Rayden wrote:Ok, regarding this kind of thinking.dusk1983 wrote: (which i find a bit creepy. Why keep only the boys?)
We as a society aren't geared towards the thinking that was prevalent a century ago. A century ago, children were innocent and beautiful little people and were basically adored for their looks and manners in a completely NON-sexual way.
So that is what i think the elves took them for, because having children serve them for eternity, laughing, playing games and basically being childlike amuses the elves.
Just my 2 cents
Time is precious, waste it wisely.
Re: Are the Bretton's our pawns?
Manit0u wrote:Personally I think it's a Peter Pan homageHighborn Rayden wrote:Ok, regarding this kind of thinking.dusk1983 wrote: (which i find a bit creepy. Why keep only the boys?)
We as a society aren't geared towards the thinking that was prevalent a century ago. A century ago, children were innocent and beautiful little people and were basically adored for their looks and manners in a completely NON-sexual way.
So that is what i think the elves took them for, because having children serve them for eternity, laughing, playing games and basically being childlike amuses the elves.
Just my 2 cents
I think it's meant to be a reference to A Midsummer Night's Dream and pre-Victorian depictions of faeries, who would often steal children away (normally firstborns), sometimes replacing them with changelings.