WE Sethayla doom army?

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Starbound
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WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Starbound »

im trying to get up a good army list, but im having trouble deciding what to do. i currently have a thousand point sethayla army:
noble on eagle*hail of doom arrow shield and light armor (159)
2*3 warhawk riders.............................................(240)
2*10 glade guard................................................(240)
2*5 glade riders.................................................(240)
1*5 waywatchers................................................(120)
grand total.......................................................(999)

my main enemies are DoC, Dwarfs, and tomb kings. sethala works well, but not against the DoC, especially when my friend likes to use flamers.
i was wondering what would be good for dealing with the DoC, or if there is a good strategy i might use with this army. thank you to those who listen
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Playonwords »

Most people are of the opinion that warhawk riders are not a good idea - they are too expensive for their potential. Same goes for glade riders - if you want warmachine hunters/mage killers go with an alter or scout noble or great eagles.

I would also seriously consider a mage and bsb, even in a 1000 pt list.

Lastly, there is a good thread already going for dealing with DoC, particulalrly flamers: http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=20416

Hope this helps
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by TreePunk »

Id say drop the Warhawk Riders for Tree Kin, though i do love the models and switch the Waywatchers with two Eagles
As for DoC i havent got a clue, still haven't won a game against them to date :p
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Joey_Boy »

It's hard to get to grips with DoC, Flamers especially. With your list it's even harder then normal since it's so fragile. The one thing I'd consider is having a Noble on great eagle with the Dragonbane gem or Dragonhelm, La, shield, Sword of might and potion of foolhardiness. This gives you a 3+ Armour and a 2+ Ward against the flaming attack of the flamers. I'f you feel one is not enough you can always go with 2 alters both with the 2+ ward against flaming. Both options keep with the theme of your list, the Eagle Noble abit more so.

I hope it helps :)
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Starbound
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Starbound »

Playonwords wrote:Most people are of the opinion that warhawk riders are not a good idea - they are too expensive for their potential. Same goes for glade riders - if you want warmachine hunters/mage killers go with an alter or scout noble or great eagles.

I would also seriously consider a mage and bsb, even in a 1000 pt list.
i realize that warhawks are now relatively weak, and i realy only use glade riders for flank attacks etc. i believe you are right, except im not so sure about the bsb and mage, being as at 1k i only have access to the lore of athel loren. and my main melee units would probably be dryads, which cant use the bsb. (i do not like ET, they fall to shreads from flamer attacks.

to address TreePunk's comment, i dont use treekin because flamers and DoC in general kill them, and my dwarf playing pal uses a flaming organ gun, so not a good idea. for now i think im going to keep the waywatchers, simply because they can kill flamers ok, and if they are in a forest its minimum -3 to hit, and if the flamers are outside of 9" its -4. i was thinking if i used a unit of warhawks and a unit of glade riders, i could smash the flamers in melee. my second big problem is the bloodhounds of khorn, which are just annoying against WE :( im not sure if killing blow works against them but if it did waywatchers would help a lot.
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Kertilien »

Are you still playing with the Choosing Characters restrictions from the army book? Those have been removed - you can take a spellweaver with Beasts or Life in any game in which one fits within the 25% restriction on Lords. At 1000 points, that's either a level 3 spellweaver with a few upgrades/equipment or a level 4 with none.

Waywatchers aren't particularly effective for their cost. Killing blow is nice, but it's rarely worth as much as having twice as many shots (often at S4) from more glade guard. It won't bypass the demons' ward saves, either. Glade riders aren't particularly effective in melee; wild riders might be a better bet, but they might still need magical support. Mass shooting from glade guard would probably work well, too.

Unfortunately, sethayla-style armies don't fair terribly well in this edition unless you have a significant advantage in ranged attacks and enough diversionary troops to delay the enemy combat troops indefinitely - not something you're going to manage at this points value against daemons or dwarves.
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Starbound »

is there somewhere i can see the removal of restrictions? im sure its true but my friend will want it from somewhere. he can be tough that way. if someone could give me a link i would be thankful :smirk:
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Beithir Seun »

Starbound wrote:is there somewhere i can see the removal of restrictions? im sure its true but my friend will want it from somewhere. he can be tough that way. if someone could give me a link i would be thankful :smirk:

Try the rulebook. If you're using 8th Edition rules, the removal of restrictions go with it.
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Starbound
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Starbound »

ah, thank you. i couldnt look in it because my friends and i share one for cost purposes and i dont currently have it. does that also take off restrictions on the one rare unit in 1k? :question:
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Krashnark »

Starbound wrote:
Playonwords wrote:and my dwarf playing pal uses a flaming organ gun, so not a good idea.
Is he using a flame cannon or is he actually claiming that his organ gun has flaming attacks? If it's the latter then he's cheating. It states very clearly in the Dwarf book that organ guns and flame cannons cannot use runes.
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Starbound »

he was using a rune. i guess i will now consider treekin. good anvils i guess, but still flamers hurt unless i find a quickway to despose of them. warhawks perhaps?
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Kertilien »

Not likely - flamers are much stronger than warhawk riders. How many flamers are you talking about? A good volley of arrow fire and a Hail of Doom Arrow could probably thin them out a bit.
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Playonwords »

Out of interest, can you explain what a "sethayla-style" army is - i have never heard of it
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by unicorn »

Playonwords wrote:Out of interest, can you explain what a "sethayla-style" army is - i have never heard of it
LEAF

Anyway, sethayla is +- death in 8th ed. From extremely competitive army it went into for fun army.
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Starbound
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Starbound »

unicorn wrote: Anyway, sethayla is +- death in 8th ed. From extremely competitive army it went into for fun army.
i have actually seen many people who share your opinion. however, i set out to find a way to use them effectively in 8th. i can deal with TK, dwarfs, and empire(provided there is no steam tank) so basically i have been testing different sethayla styles. i think i am going to try to mix in some combat units to help simply to pincer the enemy (i have found warhawk riders are actually very good at this) in my playing, the warhawk riders have earned their points every time, with the exception of against DoC. so my here is a relatively competitive one. i only need certain ways to take out pesky flamers and blood hounds, which the waywatchers will help with :D so im basically looking for fine tweaks.
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Elindar »

Another big reason why Sethayla is dead:
6th &7th standard format: 1500/2000 points
8th: 2500

Sethayla is fairly more competitive in small formats, no more things to add...
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by unicorn »

Starbound wrote:however, i set out to find a way to use them effectively in 8th. i can deal with TK, dwarfs, and empire(provided there is no steam tank)
Yeah. And this is it. Sethayla can be effective against certain armies (tough I have problems to believe you are effective against dawis, but that may be cause of different environments we play in). In 7th ed, you where able to field it against basically anything and finish with anything from draw to crusing victory. If played properly, you never loose the battle, except extremely poor luck on rolls combined with extremely strong army marching at you. Now, unlike 7th ed, there are many armies against which you will loose usually.
Unicorn's conversions (updated 1st Jun)
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BSB, mounted noble, WD noble, Branchie, Alter, Treeman, 12 WR, 10 WD, 10 GR, 10 WW, 5 Dryads, 5 WhR, 6 Tk, Altar of Khaine
Finished
Treeman, 10 WD, dragon lord, Alter, 9 WhR, 5 GR, DE sin, OK Butcher, Beast heroes x5
Starbound
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Starbound »

well, as for winning against dwarfs, i basically just fly up with my fliers and take out his bolt thrower and organ gun, than take my lord, one of the warhawk units, and one of the glade riders to go after his thunderers,which from flank and rear attacks, +casualties and the multiple charges, usually brake, and the the dwarfs are so slow that i just fly around shooting at them until they die. there have been times where i have lost, but not usually. but yes, some armies ( like DoC) pose extreme trouble, which is why i think i am going to try adding slight melee, mainly because some of the daemons are fast (like bloodhounds, and marching flamers that can then shoot) and the melee could at least tie them down for awhile while i take out the more easily shot guys (like bloodletters) any comments on this idea or suggestions on what would be best would help
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by Starbound »

Elindar wrote:
Sethayla is fairly more competitive in small formats, no more things to add...
you can always add 2 treemen to take out any stubborn little toughies. i would rather use treekin for this but even dryads would work. in higher points, all you have to do is make the army semi-sethayla, with sethaylaup to a certain extent and fill in the rest with magic support and melee.
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Re: WE Sethayla doom army?

Post by unicorn »

The problem is, the roster then do not work properly. You lack mobility you need to have; and with new rules, you lack redirecting power you where depending upon in such semi-sethayla lists in 7th ed...
Unicorn's conversions (updated 1st Jun)
Painted
BSB, mounted noble, WD noble, Branchie, Alter, Treeman, 12 WR, 10 WD, 10 GR, 10 WW, 5 Dryads, 5 WhR, 6 Tk, Altar of Khaine
Finished
Treeman, 10 WD, dragon lord, Alter, 9 WhR, 5 GR, DE sin, OK Butcher, Beast heroes x5
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