How to Use Eternal Guard

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Sethayla
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How to Use Eternal Guard

Post by Sethayla »

Well... you all remember my "How to Use Glade Riders" thread a bit back? This one is going to be different in one special way. I CANNOT USE ETERNAL GUARD! So... I will add to this post the many uses that you who use this unit have. In this respect, it is similar to "How to Use Glade Riders" except I have very little to start off with. Oh ya, and one other thing, this will not only be a list of the *uses of EG (as the one on GR was) but will be both a list of uses and an instructional. I feel this unit may have great potential, but I just cant make them work.

@Beithir Seun, I know you use EG regularly and so you can make your own long instructional post, or just a list of things I will edit in up here... either that or someone with god-like powers (aka Nag) :D can arrange all of your posts at the top of this thread!

There are probably others of you who use EG just as regularly so feel free to do the same!

So here is what I know:

1. Use as a Stick Unit to be charged by enemy forces and flank with Wild Riders and/or wardancers and/or treeman and/or treekin
a. must increase unit point cost, however, as a noble or lord is required to make the unit stubborn.

Question: Are EG worth it without the character? Would the Banner of Midwinter make up for this (as it is only one round of combat)



2. EG are best 6-7 wide to gain extra frontage. But, in situations, against high armor and high static CR units, you will want 5 wide to gain more rank bonuses.

3. The Character in your EG may be a BsB to increase stickiness.

Question: Use as babysitter for archers?

4. If using over 30, recommend use of the Rhymers Harp.

Thats all I got. Please help!

-Seth

PS: I can point out their downsides, but as I now have a fairly negative view of EG, it would be somewhat counterproductive ;)

Editing in as comments are given!

Beithir Seun's Comments!
Beithir Seun wrote:Understandably, this topic caught my attention :p Thanks Seth :wink:

As Nag said, there are quite a few different ways of using Eternal Guard. I would say that a "medium" sized unit of 15-30 is the most common configuration, with full command and, usually, an accompanying character. There is also the infamous Theban Phalanx style, using 50+ EG in one unit and, of course, there is the MSU EG using units of 10 or 12. I'll try and outline the uses, advantages etc. of these three main styles below.

MSU 10/12 man unit
MSU is probably the most difficult way to use EG. Without the advantage of large numbers or characters, MSU EG units are hard-pressed to hold charges. Their main use is as a flanking unit. As one of the few Wood Elf unit capable of breaking ranks, they are extremely useful when used on the flank of an enemy unit either in conjunction with Wild Riders or Wardancers, or even another MSU EG unit. Understandably, they lack the advantages of the other types of EG units but MSU unit do have a few of their own - they are generally more manoeuvrable, are more likely to be ignored by an opponent and are relatively expendable. If you happen to have a Noble or Highborn in the army, you can also temporarily make them Stubborn should the need arise. Their small size can often be deceptive and so an opponent may feel confident of breaking them, even with Stubborn, and so they can be used as a surprise tarpit unit against an unwary opponent.

Because of the difficulties involved, MSU Eternal Guard isn't especially common and can be hard to get right so I wouldn't recommend trying it unless you already have experience using Eternal Guard within a Wood Elf army.

"Medium" Unit 15-30
This unit gives a large amount of 'room to manoeuvre' when it comes to incorporating it into an army list. Basically, you can have it configured in nearly every way. I'll go through a few of the common configurations that I've seen:

-Naked 15-man unit :
A unit of 15 with full command can provide a good holding unit for the vital turns where you want those combined charges. While they aren't big enough to withstand turn after turn of heavy casualties, they are usually enough to hold up an enemy unit for a turn or two, relying on their static CR to win or draw the combat (or at least to not lose too badly). Having a unit this size keep the unit as cheap as possible while still maintaining its Anvil-like characteristics but, without the Stubborness granted by an accompanying character, are not going to be able to hold off enemies for long. As such, this is the type of unit you want to employ for that single decisive combat. They will likely take several casualties when receiving the charge but, with their good static CR, they *should* be able to hold long enough for you to charge in Wild Riders and the like and break said enemy unit.

-Tooled-up 20-30 man unit:
I say 20 man unit, but this would also include the various sizes used to enable different formations (such as 3x7, 4x6 etc.). Basically, this is the 'standard' EG unit type - big enough to withstand significant casualties and still dish out damage, with a large static CR and accompanied by a character to make them Stubborn. This is essentially the ideal Anvil EG unit. The Stubborness makes all the difference here and will often more than earn the points back.

While this size unit puts you back a significant amount in points, this EG unit is probably the only Wood Elf unit that can reliably handle a one-on-one combat. The typical +5 CR (3 ranks, standard and outnumber) is usually enough to stop all but the heaviest cavalry in their tracks, and even if that isn't the case the Stubborn rule will keep them in place 83% of the time.

This sort of unit can be lead by either a Highborn, Noble or BSB. The BSB obviously bestows the +1CR for a Battle Standard as well as a re-roll on the Break Test, raising the probability of the unit holding to 97%. A Highborn can use his 100pts of Magic Items to benefit the unit as a whole - Amber Pendant with a GW can allow the highborn to kill enemies before they attack the unit, Blight of Terrors can bestow Immunity to Fear and Terror on the unit, Rhymer's Harp can bestow a 5+ Ward Save. Personally, I find Rhymer's Harp to be a bit OTT on this size unit but some people find it can still be useful. Having either of these characters in an EG unit can also be beneficial to the rest of the army, with both the BSB and the General's Leadership most likely being available to several other units besides the EG.

Personally, I use both a Highborn and a BSB in my Eternal Guard, allowing me to benefit from the advantages of both characters. This does, however, result in a fairly costly unit.

-Gold-plated 50+ man unit:
I don't have much experience with this size unit but anyone who has read King Leonidas' Theban Phalanx thread will know both the advantages and the disadvantages of such a unit. Obviously, this unit has the potential to take massive casualties but, by the same token, it needs to be massively tooled-up to make it worthwhile. With such a large number of men, a BSB is absolutely necessary and a Highborn with Rhymer's Harp is wholly worthwhile with such a large unit. I would advise anyone interested in the Theban Phalanx to look here
Last edited by Sethayla on 02 Jun 2008, 02:48, edited 4 times in total.
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How to use Glade Riders
How to use Eternal Guard
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard *Beithir Seun NEEDED =)*

Post by lune »

Hi Seth! I'm not Beithir, but hope you can get something proper from my post =)

I'm personally using EG often (still only in one small unit with a baby-sitter noble). I've often found EG avoided by my opponent, due to being a) stubborn and b) the baby-sitter swinging a GW with Amber Pendant, leaving the unit a quite effective hammer against other rank'n'files (of course I then have to also put a Warbanner in the unit). With a front 5 to 7 bright (depending on how much shooting and wheeling I expect - the more the smaller my front), this unit starts with 3 to 5 against them in CC, but can kill enough to be at 6 or 7 to 5 to 6 at the end of CC. Intersting is that this small unit (10 to 13 models with full command + Noble) can be added as an addition to other units instead of building your army around a large block of EG (this unit costs ith 13 models, full command,WB and mentioned noble with AP, GW, light armour and shield 329 pts - about a tree :p ).
Also, this unit can still (depending on the situation on the table) work fot one or two rounds as an anvil, while standing their man relativly sure even without BSB.
Also, since they always are (due to the Noble) a point sink, they can be used for baiting. With a muso they have Ld 10 for rallying and will be back in position the turn they get the first chance to rally. I know that GR are better in this purpose, but found my opponents often ignoring them or simply shooting them down, then continuing to engage the rest of my army. I believe that being NOT ItP is one of the biggest strenghs for EG in our current list and also a good reason to take them, as luring you enemy with this unit is not a common tactic.

Other than that, I sometimes use them to guard one flank, giving the noble items to survive knight charges (such as oaken armour).
As you all know, after the first round of combat knights are no threat anymore(unless it's chosen knights or something similar..). With a flank hold by them and supported by Dryads or Wardancers, the rest of your army can concentrate to roll up the opponent from one flank. This strategy only makes sense IMO with a negated flank, ut can lure your opponent in some false thoughts when placing the EG as one of the first units about in the middle. This hopefully answers your question to use EG as baby-sitter for archers.

While at it, I can't find a proper use for them without a noble - maybe if making them 25+ using them as a regular infantry block, but that would most assuredly be one of the weaker builds..
It's not much I could post (another 30 EG are still waiting to be painted.. :angry: ), but I hope my post was useful to you.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard *Beithir Seun NEEDED =)*

Post by farothel »

I use EG quite a lot but how exactly depends on my army list.
-bodyguard for the general. 20 of them with a highborn in it. Highborn has GW, amber pendant and Annoyance of Netlings. Full command and warbanner in the unit.
-bodyguard for the BSB. Again 20 of them with the BSB. Most of the times the BSB has oaken armour to keep him alive. Again full command and warbanner in the unit.
-I have 1 build where I use 30 of them, again with full command and warbanner. In the unit is the highborn with Rhymer's harp and a BSB with Banner of Ariel. 30 models with 5+ ward and fear causing can do a lot of damage. The only drawback is the fact that the total (unit plus characters) is around 800 ptns, so I use this mostly in 3000+ games.

What they do is quite simular and depends on the opponent. It's either a combination charge with something else (WR, dryads and such) or as an anvil to take a charge, stay on for one combat and then the next turn I do the combi charge.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard *Beithir Seun NEEDED =)*

Post by David L »

I disagree with point 2 - that they should be 6-7 wide. Sometimes maybe you want them wide, but they do very little damage to many enemies. Against skeletons you want more attacks, but not against Dwarfs. The bigger virtue of width is taking up more space, which argues for noticably wider than 6 or 7. More commonly you want them for rank bonus, which means 5 wide.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard *Beithir Seun NEEDED =)*

Post by Naggie »

There are more than one way of using EGuards!

We are, at heart, an MSU army. Why aren't anyone thinking about using EGuards as an MSU unit? 5x2 costs the same as archers, are great for protecting your flanks from fast cav/flyers, and will get you 10 WS5 attacks on the charge and 15 WS5 when receiving one. 5 Fast Cav won't stand a chance. If the enemy plays defensivly, your 10 EGuards are great flankers as they CAN remove enemy rank bonuses. I feel EGuards would be the perfect MSU unit in all armies who make use of the MSU style. Cheap, good movement, good WS, and loads of attacks. Sadly, no Asrai player is testing this idea.

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Post by farothel »

The only problem is that I often run lists with a treeman ancient, so that means at 2K that eternal guard are a special choice and with wardancers and wild riders also special I can't run a lot of small EG units. Maybe in a Highborn led list where they are core you could do it.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard *Beithir Seun NEEDED =)*

Post by Mist Walker »

I previously used them extensively.

With a warbanner and reasonably protected bsb when ranked up 4 deep they make an excellent hammer that can also act as an anvil thanks to its massive combat res.

They also do very well against other tarpits seeing as they put out a massive number of attacks and can then be supported by something else. With the enemy hardly daring to send anything else in (sending a flanking unit in against a treeman isn't a popular idea). In tgis way you can wear away the enemy's unit (through crumble if undead).

Just wait until later in the game and smack em' down in front of the enemy's hardest unit and run forwards with wild riders nearby.

If the accompanying character has ellynett's brooch then it is very viable to have glade guard in front ready to flee, though I've never tried this and it slows them down.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard *Beithir Seun NEEDED =)*

Post by lune »

Nagathi wrote:There are more than one way of using EGuards!

We are, at heart, an MSU army. Why aren't anyone thinking about using EGuards as an MSU unit? 5x2 costs the same as archers, ... Sadly, no Asrai player is testing this idea.

~ Nag
To be honest, I feel that for giving them a try, buying 30 or 40 models at a cost of 150 to 200 $ is a too huge investment only to see if they work as your personal army style requires them to do. So I assume most players spend their money on units they know they'll fit their theme/playstyle more. Give me some months to pant them Nag and I promise I'll write something about how MSU EG with and without Command and/or noble perfomrs :p
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard *Beithir Seun NEEDED =)*

Post by Beithir Seun »

Understandably, this topic caught my attention :p Thanks Seth :wink:

As Nag said, there are quite a few different ways of using Eternal Guard. I would say that a "medium" sized unit of 15-30 is the most common configuration, with full command and, usually, an accompanying character. There is also the infamous Theban Phalanx style, using 50+ EG in one unit and, of course, there is the MSU EG using units of 10 or 12. I'll try and outline the uses, advantages etc. of these three main styles below.

MSU 10/12 man unit
MSU is probably the most difficult way to use EG. Without the advantage of large numbers or characters, MSU EG units are hard-pressed to hold charges. Their main use is as a flanking unit. As one of the few Wood Elf unit capable of breaking ranks, they are extremely useful when used on the flank of an enemy unit either in conjunction with Wild Riders or Wardancers, or even another MSU EG unit. Understandably, they lack the advantages of the other types of EG units but MSU unit do have a few of their own - they are generally more manoeuvrable, are more likely to be ignored by an opponent and are relatively expendable. If you happen to have a Noble or Highborn in the army, you can also temporarily make them Stubborn should the need arise. Their small size can often be deceptive and so an opponent may feel confident of breaking them, even with Stubborn, and so they can be used as a surprise tarpit unit against an unwary opponent.

Because of the difficulties involved, MSU Eternal Guard isn't especially common and can be hard to get right so I wouldn't recommend trying it unless you already have experience using Eternal Guard within a Wood Elf army.

"Medium" Unit 15-30
This unit gives a large amount of 'room to manoeuvre' when it comes to incorporating it into an army list. Basically, you can have it configured in nearly every way. I'll go through a few of the common configurations that I've seen:

-Naked 15-man unit :
A unit of 15 with full command can provide a good holding unit for the vital turns where you want those combined charges. While they aren't big enough to withstand turn after turn of heavy casualties, they are usually enough to hold up an enemy unit for a turn or two, relying on their static CR to win or draw the combat (or at least to not lose too badly). Having a unit this size keep the unit as cheap as possible while still maintaining its Anvil-like characteristics but, without the Stubborness granted by an accompanying character, are not going to be able to hold off enemies for long. As such, this is the type of unit you want to employ for that single decisive combat. They will likely take several casualties when receiving the charge but, with their good static CR, they *should* be able to hold long enough for you to charge in Wild Riders and the like and break said enemy unit.

-Tooled-up 20-30 man unit:
I say 20 man unit, but this would also include the various sizes used to enable different formations (such as 3x7, 4x6 etc.). Basically, this is the 'standard' EG unit type - big enough to withstand significant casualties and still dish out damage, with a large static CR and accompanied by a character to make them Stubborn. This is essentially the ideal Anvil EG unit. The Stubborness makes all the difference here and will often more than earn the points back.

While this size unit puts you back a significant amount in points, this EG unit is probably the only Wood Elf unit that can reliably handle a one-on-one combat. The typical +5 CR (3 ranks, standard and outnumber) is usually enough to stop all but the heaviest cavalry in their tracks, and even if that isn't the case the Stubborn rule will keep them in place 83% of the time.

This sort of unit can be lead by either a Highborn, Noble or BSB. The BSB obviously bestows the +1CR for a Battle Standard as well as a re-roll on the Break Test, raising the probability of the unit holding to 97%. A Highborn can use his 100pts of Magic Items to benefit the unit as a whole - Amber Pendant with a GW can allow the highborn to kill enemies before they attack the unit, Blight of Terrors can bestow Immunity to Fear and Terror on the unit, Rhymer's Harp can bestow a 5+ Ward Save. Personally, I find Rhymer's Harp to be a bit OTT on this size unit but some people find it can still be useful. Having either of these characters in an EG unit can also be beneficial to the rest of the army, with both the BSB and the General's Leadership most likely being available to several other units besides the EG.

Personally, I use both a Highborn and a BSB in my Eternal Guard, allowing me to benefit from the advantages of both characters. This does, however, result in a fairly costly unit.

-Gold-plated 50+ man unit:
I don't have much experience with this size unit but anyone who has read King Leonidas' Theban Phalanx thread will know both the advantages and the disadvantages of such a unit. Obviously, this unit has the potential to take massive casualties but, by the same token, it needs to be massively tooled-up to make it worthwhile. With such a large number of men, a BSB is absolutely necessary and a Highborn with Rhymer's Harp is wholly worthwhile with such a large unit. I would advise anyone interested in the Theban Phalanx to look here

OK, this post has gone on quite long enough and I don't feel I've actually added much more to the discussion but never mind.

I will just address one point though:
Nagathi wrote:Sadly, no Asrai player is testing this idea
Here, I disagree. There are plenty of Asrai players trying to play MSU but, because of how EG work, it is a lot more difficult than you might think. I've only seen MSU Eternal Guard work three times and have only successfully used it myself once, and even then it was a bit by accident.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard *Beithir Seun NEEDED =)*

Post by ArchMagosAlchemys »

Hey, that's almost what the LEAF articles say. :D If I can use some models I already have, I'll try MSU EG. What plastics can I use for EG? DE warriors have armour, GG are a bit hard to change, DoW pikes don't look right...
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard *Beithir Seun NEEDED =)*

Post by Beithir Seun »

ArchMagosAlchemys wrote:Hey, that's almost what the LEAF articles say. :D

That's a relief! :D What would people think if one of the LEAF writers contradicted a LEAF article? :eek:

I will admit, I did steal your "Gold-plated" label :wink: Hope you didn't get copyrights :paranoid:

ArchMagosAlchemys wrote:If I can use some models I already have, I'll try MSU EG. What plastics can I use for EG? DE warriors have armour, GG are a bit hard to change, DoW pikes don't look right...
If you have any HE Spearmen, they might do the job, although there's the armour thing again...
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard *Beithir Seun NEEDED =)*

Post by ArchMagosAlchemys »

I have a couple of boxes of DE Warrior AND a DE army. The DE weapon looks a little spear-staff-like. I could paint the armour as leather, although some of it seems to be chain. I can then add the shields later, although I also have 50 Spear Warriors and 30 Crossbows and I don't need more of either for an army I've never used! (And which is due for a new book soon)
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard *Beithir Seun NEEDED =)*

Post by farothel »

The EG have armour as well (although not much), and they have a 5+ armour save so you can get away with using armoured models. And in games against friends while testing a new idea I don't think they object too much about using other models (I wouldn't anyway). You can also use old WE spearman from previous editions. That way you stay at least in the same army. I was planning on doing that with my second EG unit but then Ebay gave me a killer deal on a unit of new ones, so now I can field 40 new ones (half of them painted).

EDIT: I'm thinking about testing 2 15 men units, one with a character with moonstone this evening. Should be fun.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard *Beithir Seun NEEDED =)*

Post by Naggie »

Beithir Seun wrote:Because of the difficulties involved, MSU Eternal Guard isn't especially common and can be hard to get right so I wouldn't recommend trying it unless you already have experience using Eternal Guard within a Wood Elf army.
Maybe it's just me and my many years of Dark Elf MSU usage?

Nagathi wrote:Sadly, no Asrai player is testing this idea
Here, I disagree. There are plenty of Asrai players trying to play MSU but, because of how EG work, it is a lot more difficult than you might think. I've only seen MSU Eternal Guard work three times and have only successfully used it myself once, and even then it was a bit by accident.
I used some EGuards in my early armylists (when I still had my Druchii mindset) and they worked well as flank protectors. I played pretty defensivly at the time, and they managed to fend off the Ellyrion Reavers, Great Eagles, and Wolf Riders who tried to pincer me and get to my flanks.

5 Ellyrion Reavers with muso vs 10 naked EGuards.
5 Ellyrions charge, 5 attacks. 2.5 hits. 1.6667 wounds. 1.3889 Dead EGuards.
5 Horses. 5 attacks. 2.5 hits. 1.25 wounds. 0.8333 Dead EGuards.
Total of 2 Dead EGuards.

8 Eternal Guards attack back. 11 attacks. 7.3333 hits. 3.6667 wounds. 2.4445 Dead Ellyrion Reavers.
Total of 2 Dead Ellyrion Reavers.
Equal amounts of casualties, but EGuards had an extra rank, and outnumbers. The Reavers have to test at Ld6 (41.667% chance to succeed)

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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard

Post by Sethayla »

farothel wrote: EDIT: I'm thinking about testing 2 15 men units, one with a character with moonstone this evening. Should be fun.
Great! Eager to hear how they go!

Thank you for your informative replies, and keep 'em coming! I will edit in all the info once I have some time!

-Seth
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard

Post by farothel »

Sethayla wrote:
farothel wrote: EDIT: I'm thinking about testing 2 15 men units, one with a character with moonstone this evening. Should be fun.
Great! Eager to hear how they go!

Thank you for your informative replies, and keep 'em coming! I will edit in all the info once I have some time!

-Seth
I didn't in the end as we were uneven and I was the only one able to field 4000 ptns, so I took on 2 O&G armies and slaughtered them. I did use EG, but one block of 30 with a highborn with Rhymer's harp and a BSB with Banner of Ariel. The opponents had 2 rock lobbers, 4 spear chucka's, 4 giants and Skarsnik and Gnobla (plus a lot of other stuff of course). One of my opponents was fiendishly accurate with those lobbers, scoring 3 hits on my EG. So before they entered combat they were already reduced to just half unit strenght (5+ ward save and 4+ regeneration save from the spell Ariel's blessing notwhitstanding). But in combat they came up against goblins and then all those Str3 attacks can really do their thing. The BSB didn't survive (the special character killed him), but the highborn did. the unit even survived 2 giants jumping up and down and one giant falling flat on it (the same giant that killed my treeman ancient with his Thumb with club).

At the end of turn 6 they only had 1 fanatic left (who had miracously survived since turn 2) and I had lost about 1200 points. I must admit I had a bit of luck at some times (3 dryads out of 8 suriving a charge through 3 fanatics to kill a shaman), but so had they (my treeman ancient, those 3 hits with the rock lobber).

Anyway, back to the EG: they did okay but not really great. Of course they were reduced quite heavily due to the shooting before they got in combat. But against weak opponents like goblins they can even then be quite deadly. Also the fact that one of my spellsingers had Ariel's blessing and that I owned the magic phase (active magic hunting helps) made that I could give them a regeneration save, which really helps when 2 giants are jumping on your unit.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard

Post by Sethayla »

Great uses, anyone else got experiance with these?

And could a Moderator please put Beithir's post under the first one as I'd rather not re-type that all ;)

-Seth

PS some great discussion!
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard

Post by Ramesesis »

The EG with a Highborn can give even dwarfs a headache out of pure frustration of meeting a non-dawi unit that is stubborn! :p

Be wary of where you place them and who you fight, but with the Highborn with Amber pendant+GW they can take and hold a charge of heavy cavalry.

Using a small unit of them is not that bad, and I did it once, it failed to work, since my friend found a path past them while they tired to get him to charge them and put him at a difficult angle.
However, they chocked my friend as they charged his Grave guard in the flank and did give them some casualities, even if I could not take the Grave guard out with the other units before the game ended, the round they held it in place gave me time to get dryads and wardancers into a charging position and attack.

Never underestimate the 10 man EG unit.
Leafstalker wrote:Nothing more beautiful then seeing a massive Bret charge stall into the formed ranks of the Eternal Guard... my Highborn Ramesesis had to harden his heart as he dueled with the Bret Lords and cut them down.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard

Post by Beithir Seun »

Sethayla wrote:And could a Moderator please put Beithir's post under the first one as I'd rather not re-type that all ;)
Why not just summarise it and just stick it into a couple of brief (or not :p) bulletpoints?

Alternatively, take the 'lazy' option and copy and paste :D

Or repeatedly PM Naggie until he does what you want
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard

Post by Sethayla »

I'm sure Nagi will be happy with you for making that suggestion :lol:

And I think that I couldn't put it better.

-Seth
Nagathi wrote:Only on Asrai.org can a thread about a joke turn into a mature, serious and intellectual discussion. It's almost frightening...
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard

Post by ArchMagosAlchemys »

Seth. Copy Beithir's post and edit your own one by adding his.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard

Post by innerwolf »

Hi. As this thread is about how to use eternal guard, I feel my question belongs here.

This is the list I have planned to use:


Hathol Sûl , Highborn @ 251 Pts
General; Great weapon; Longbow
Amber Pendant
Gwytherc's Horn
Oaken armour

BSB noble @ 142 Pts
Light armour
Stone of the Crystal Mere
Sword of Might

Branchwraith @ 140 Pts
Level 1
Cluster of Radiants

Spellsinger @ 115 pts
1 dispel scroll

18 Eternal Guards @ 258 Pts
Standard; Musician; Champion

10 Glade Guard @ 120 Pts


10 Glade Guard @ 120 Pts


8 Dryads @ 96 Pts

8 Dryads @ 96 pts

5 Wild Riders @ 148 Pts
Standard; Musician


6 Wardancers @ 108 Pts


3 Warhawk Riders @ 120 pts

1 Treeman @ 285 Pts


The Highborn's configuration looks balanced and all-arounder, but I'm tented to try changing it for Rhymer's Harp and AoN.
Is the Harp worth it for such a small unit (19 EG + Highborn)? Should I include the BSB into the unit to benefit from the item, and save the points from his ward for something else, or it looks like too many eggs in one basket?

If the BSB doesn't go with the EG, I planned on keeping him inside the wardancer unit.

Please note I can't include more EG.

Thank you.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard

Post by Beithir Seun »

Innerwolf, from my personal experience, I don't find the Harp to be worth it in a unit under 25 strong. It's worth increases proportionally as the unit size increases but with only 19 or 20 models benefitting, I find it doesn't earn it's points back enough to be worth investing in.

For myself, I put both the Highborn and the BSB in the EG unit. It does make it very expensive but it also makes it pretty much impossible to break. You will be able to gain maximum static CR in 4 ranks of 5 and, if you still lose the combat, you are Stubborn Ld9 with a reroll. With the Highborn in the unit, you are almost guaranteed to cause a couple of casualties so you can reduce the number of attacks being returned, even against High Elves. If you keep the Treeman near the Eternal Guard (he makes an excellent flanker) then he can also benefit from the BSB's reroll.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard

Post by innerwolf »

Well, I suppose I will have to screen the EG unit with dryads against shooty opponents.
If I include the BSB in the unit, should I change his equipment? Or is he right as he is?
I could outfit him with The Blight of terrors and save 15 points from the Horn, making the unit more solid against fear causers. What combination do you suggest?

Thank you for the help.
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Re: How to Use Eternal Guard

Post by Beithir Seun »

That all depends on what opponents you plan to face regularly. If you play against Vampires, Tomb Kings and Daemons all the time then investing in some anti-Fear items would be a good idea. Otherwise, you can rely on the outnumbering advantage and static CR to win or hold against enemies. The BSB is fine as he is for me but if you feel that the BoT is justified then you can give him that instead.
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