Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

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jgibz
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Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by jgibz »

I really enjoy playing all-comer lists and therefore I concentrate on building lists that can play against a large variety of units. So, I spent some time analyzing the strengths and roles of the Wood Elf units (excluding characters) and I came up with what I think is a nice diagram to show their roles. My intent is for this diagram to help me make sure that I have covered the possibilities of whatever might show up in the next battle. There are likely some values that may not be perfect, so, I hope this will invigorate discussion about the roles of the units.

Link to PDF -> http://listhammer.com/images/WE-Units-O ... ic_2.0.pdf

Image

[Edit 1] Let's look at an 1000-point example of how to use this diagram. If I wanted to have an anvil, which is not mandatory with Wood Elves, I could pick a unit of Eternal Guard. The Eternal Guard are also decent at fighting monsters as they can win with static combat resolution. Therefore, I have those two areas addressed in my army. Now, if I am going to have an anvil, I need a hammer. I really enjoy taking Treemen, so I am going to choose that to be my hammer. The Treeman not only adds a hammer to my army, but also adds some anti-armor capability and duplicates my anvil (see posts about role redundancy, more on this in a bit). Now my army doesn't have anything to address close combat support, warmachines & chaff, redirecting/modifying movement, or ranged. Ranged is a role similar to anvil that isn't required, yet, it is very powerful in a Wood Elf army. One unit that addresses many of those roles is Warhawk Riders. So, I will get some of them. Now, most of the roles are fulfilled, except range, but, I do not have very much role redundancy with my units. In particular, I only have one unit for monsters and one for anti-armor. I can fix this by taking two units of Deepwood Scouts, one with Hagbane Tips, and another with Arcane Bodkins. The Deepwood Scouts, while not great at it, could also help out with redirection if necessary. Together, the 1000 point list looks like:

20 Eternal Guard, Full Command, Gleaming Pennant
3 Warhawk Riders
5 Deepwood Scouts, Hagbane Tips
5 Deepwood Scouts, Arcane Bodkins
1 Treeman
and 195 points left over for characters (likely a Level 2 Spellsinger for me)

What other lists could you put together? How else do you see yourself using this diagram?

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Link to JPG of v 1.0 -> http://listhammer.com/images/WE-Units-Overview.pdf
Link to PDF of v 1.0 -> http://listhammer.com/images/WE-Units-Overview.pdf
Last edited by jgibz on 29 Jan 2015, 20:31, edited 2 times in total.
Syphilis
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by Syphilis »

Jgibz... This is amazing. I'm more of a painter but I am obsessed with writing lists that work both theme wise and game wise. I've been racking my brain with what to include in a 2000pnt list so I don't paint models I won't use. This will help so much!
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Cosmos
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by Cosmos »

That is a really cool chart!! For a casual gamer that likes to be somewhat competetive this is a great tool
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by Aezeal »

Very nice and pretty correct too. I'd give the WW a milimeter more close combat bar... they do have 2 handweapons so they are clearly better in melee than GG. Not that it would change their role in the overall picture in anyway.. just being annoying :D

Also I'm not entirely sure about redirecting and modifying movement. Eagles can march block and I'd sacrifice them by making them a roadblock.. but while I might marchblock with sisters or WH I'd never sacrifice them that easily becuase they are too expensive.. I see it as 2 different roles.. but for the easy of the chart it might be best like this.
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by Rafiki »

Very nice way to show which unit has which role and/or dual roles, and it definitely deserves the name overveiw infographic.
Hope it gets added to the LEAF tactical articles for 8th edition, would fit nicely there.

And i laughed when i saw where number seven(treekins) were placed
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by Syphilis »

That made me sad. .. bit is good to know that I'm not the only one who's a bit confused what Treekin do.
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by Aezeal »

Ow I don't think that is correct though. They are an anvil, they are not even a very bad anvil.. it's just that EG is better. I think it should be changed. If only the best unit was placed in a certain spot then lots of units would only get 1 role, and more would get no roles at all.
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by jgibz »

Thanks for the feedback so far. I have revised the graphic and created version 2.

@Cosmos - I agree that this won't help people create power lists. It will actually probably do the opposite :)

@Aezeal - I agree that I was a little too harsh with the Tree Kin. I have raised their value and included them as an anvil. I also increased the CC support of the Waywatchers. Your last point about redirecting and modifying movement is very interesting. Originally, I had them as two separate roles. But, there was so much overlap with regards to units between the two that I decided to put them together (likely an error :)). The exception to the overlap might be the Sisters as they aren't very strong at redirecting as you mention. The Warhawks might be good at redirecting in the cases where they can flee. I think I can put in another circle right next to the current redirecting/modifying movement circle to separate them without causing too much of a problem. I would also add another attribute to each unit. How does everyone feel about that?
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by Aezeal »

jgibz wrote:Thanks for the feedback so far. I have revised the graphic and created version 2.

@Cosmos - I agree that this won't help people create power lists. It will actually probably do the opposite :)

@Aezeal - I agree that I was a little too harsh with the Tree Kin. I have raised their value and included them as an anvil. I also increased the CC support of the Waywatchers. Your last point about redirecting and modifying movement is very interesting. Originally, I had them as two separate roles. But, there was so much overlap with regards to units between the two that I decided to put them together (likely an error :)). The exception to the overlap might be the Sisters as they aren't very strong at redirecting as you mention. The Warhawks might be good at redirecting in the cases where they can flee. I think I can put in another circle right next to the current redirecting/modifying movement circle to separate them without causing too much of a problem. I would also add another attribute to each unit. How does everyone feel about that?
Well no need to make it more complicated on my behalf, it's just that the GE is the only thing cheap enough that I'd consider sacrificing it.
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by sunstrider »

Neat :P
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by Rafiki »

While it certainly is the cheapest it is not the only one i would consider using specifically as chaff.

I like to bring 5 wardancers no musician or champ for 75 points.
- In a forest they can be a tarpit that cast last for up to two turns(this was against 23 savage orcs with full command, WD was three wide)
- They soak up chariot charges like no other with the +3 ward from shadows coil(I love that they specifically mentions that the dance is chosen BEFORE impact hits)
- If the opponent ignores them you might get a good flank or rear charges and remove the opponents rank bonus.
- Wizard assassins, need i say more?

They only have one dance left, that i no longer know what to do with, storm of blades just isnt the same when the second rank doesnt benefit from it anymore :cry:

And i guess one could try to use the minimum of deepwood scouts for 80 points(thats with arrows), but thats seems inefficient.

On the last note i was looking at the new chart, and as far as i can see treekin is the only unit with only one use.
But have any one else used treekin without them get steamrolled immediately when they saw combat, because that always seem to be my problem when i use them, been wondering if i should try them with 18 models for the horde formation with 60 attacks and see if that works.
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by jgibz »

Thanks for the sticky. It is always nice to have your work appreciated.

A few things that I reflect on as I look at this diagram:

1. Wardancers seem to be able to play in more roles than any other unit. How do you see this as you play your games?
2. The Wood Elf units appear to be fairly specialized (even more than High Elf units) meaning that as soon as they are out of their role, their efficiency drops dramatically. How does this seem to affect your games?
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by Q10fanatic »

Wardancers have made a comeback in my lists. I'm bringing 2 units of 6, with two spears each. In my last few games one unit has: broken witches receiving a charge and destroyed them on overrun; broken cold one knight bus; forced a dwarf block to test after combat instead of my TMA; survived a double charge by 2 blocks of Skaven slaves; defeated a chaos chariot; and taken out numerous chaff.

They're like duct tape, not ideal in many situations but more than adequate, far outperforming their points cost.
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by Tuladin »

This is amazing! Thank you for the time and effort it took to put this together. Like many, I paint and convert more, but this makes putting together a competitive list a snap.
jgibz
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by jgibz »

If you are interested, I posted a High Elf infographic similar to the Wood Elf one --> http://www.ulthuan.net/forum/viewtopic. ... 969#p89796

It was much harder to create due to my perception that there are more versatile High Elf units.
jgibz
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by jgibz »

Thanks for the positive feedback. The way I categorized units is subjective. Therefore, I have made a tool to help everyone categorize units: http://listhammer.com/unit-comparison/

Enjoy
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by BalkanDS »

Thanks jgibz the infographics and tools are really helpful. Though is it possible to remove characters from the the tool as they really aren't units and shouldn't be compared to them when determining roles.
jgibz
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Re: Wood Elf Unit Overview Infographic

Post by jgibz »

BalkanDS wrote:Thanks jgibz the infographics and tools are really helpful. Though is it possible to remove characters from the the tool as they really aren't units and shouldn't be compared to them when determining roles.
I thought about leaving characters out. Thank you for confirming that thought. I have removed the characters from the unit comparisons.
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