How do you ussualy use you W.Riders?

[Balakul]

I am basing my army toward 2400 (probably 100-200pts extra for "side deck")

ATM having arsenal of:

• 4x12 GG
  24 GR
  15 Dryads
  Elven steed mounted General
  and a spell weaver on its way

(as you can see I really enjoy running core units)

Now I was thinking to include WR. but I wonder how many and in what manure?
First I was thinking of running 3 lines of 5 WR to take advantage of spears...
but as I read trough posts here it seems u guys only take one line units.
So is better to play MSU with WR? how many in one line? Do you put Noble/lord only in one line, or do you provide
each line with it's own hero? Do you run banners, musician champs in your lines?

Second, do you think WR can get to nasty? I don't wat to construct army that will get restricted on every tournament in E.U.

[Aezeal]

Ok: let me put it like this: What advantage of spears.

Look at the rules for spears for cavalry and at support attacks for cavalry and you will get what we mean.... (p 91 and p. 82 (and maybe 48 for updating supporting attacks rules).

I run them in single ranks of 5-7. try to get them in flanks (or one in front and next turn the others in the flank etc), the only reason to run them in larger groups would be to have some left after a unit of archers shoots them, personally I think a 2nd unit will work just as well in that case (and since you have to target units if they do 7 wounds on a unit of 5 you will basicly not loose 7 WR like you otherwise would).

[Mollesvinet]

Two units of 7 would be me suggestion. One on each flank usually, unless there is a specific reason to put them together. The number 7 is mainly based on not having any models in second rank but still being able to take minor damage without losing too much effectiveness.

[Balakul]

Two units of 7 ...

Ok: let me put it like this: ...

Oh I see thank u both. Now that you pointed out those things, everything seems logical and clear to me

Just one other thing... how do you suit up your glade captins for riders? With BSB, or fire standar? Spear?

[Mollesvinet]

I wouldn't put a character in there, they basically already have 3 attacks each on the charge so the improvement in damage will be minor.

I give mine shields and banner. For magical banner I use gleaming pennant for re-rolling failed frenzy and/or flame banner for taking out regenerating scum. Musicians aren't worth it as they are fast cav and if they draw a combat, or need to rally, then chances are that you already lost most of the unit.

[Aezeal]

I need to say though that in my experience wild riders tend to die every game. I have lots of units which tend to survive (so everything they killed is bonus) but WR usually die. That means you basicly want them to deal enough damage to have been worth it (of course they full fill a certain role and that is worth things too but still). If you put them vs large blocks of troops they will usually kill a lot first turn.. and less after that. It's better to let them whipe out small units 10-15 wounds (so that if you kill models they really won't hit back.. in stead of a unit of 30 where killing 10 will have made no difference on how many attacks will be aimed at the WR after the charge) you can either kill those out right or get such a good CR that you can overrun them at least at first. Best thing would be getting them to flank or rear charge units that are already in melee (I must admit that I usually play with so much archers I hardly have anvils enough to pull this off myself. But a treeman or EG unit would be able to get things done (and if you play comped games (no personal exp with that) you will nearly Always have some of that when I look at armylists in this forum).

[Mollesvinet]

Good point by Aezeal. It is better to wait another turn for the perfect charge than to rush into a combat where your wild riders will be wiped in return. Go try them out!

Also a small trick for fast cav (or skirmishers) with frenzy: If you don't want to be charging next turn you can place your wild riders looking away from the enemy, basically mooning the enemy. Then next turn you don't have to test for frenzy charge and can then proceed to put them in the perfect position. It goes without saying that you must be careful with this if you are within charge arcs of your opponents!

[Avian]

Another important point to remember about wild riders is their psychological impact on the other player. After seeing them charge an opponent won't forget it in a hurry and will be rightly wary if them next time. You can use this to your advantage to make him react to the WR rather than something else.

They are also brutally effective if you use a treeman or Treeman Ancient to pin a unit in place for their charge.

[Balakul]

I see I see, i was also tending to use WR on targets like demon princ... any thoughts on that?

[Phil Rossiter]

They have a good chance to put a wound on but they'd need help.

[Pawiie]

When I use them I do so in groups of 6-7
and I ONLY use them for charging the sides.. they 8 of 10 times can't hold the line against groups of units (granted I play against a lot of 40+ units).
A TM holding down a unit, and then charge in their side, it hurts them as you have ASF, but as you don't have a second rank, you don't disrupt them and they still get their rank bonus.
They do a lot of dmg though in that first turn.

That said, I rarely use them and I'd go with 2x5 Sisters of thorn to control their movement phase (IMPORTANT!!!) and just field more GR to kite the enemy with their Ambush and fast cav.

my two cents on the matter.

//Pawiie

[Balakul]

When I use them I do so in groups of 6-7
and I ONLY use them for charging the sides.. they 8 of 10 times can't hold the line against groups of units (granted I play against a lot of 40+ units).
A TM holding down a unit, and then charge in their side, it hurts them as you have ASF, but as you don't have a second rank, you don't disrupt them and they still get their rank bonus.
They do a lot of dmg though in that first turn.

That said, I rarely use them and I'd go with 2x5 Sisters of thorn to control their movement phase (IMPORTANT!!!) and just field more GR to kite the enemy with their Ambush and fast cav.

my two cents on the matter.

//Pawiie

Hmmm, seams to me there must be something on those sisters... need to double check rulebook for them . Thanks those two cents gave me some thoughts...

[Phil Rossiter]

It's good to have both.

[Aezeal]

The enternity king says that we now hvae 3... doomfirewarlocks are a nice addition. Get one unit of each

[Arwen]

I am a noob WE player but have been using Wild Riders in units of 6 or 7 and find they are glass hammers.

They throw out the wounds but easily die to the return attacks.

One useful trick is placing High Magic Weaver (on horse) in with the Wild Riders after he has cast some low casting spells on turns 1-3 he then adds extra wounds to the Wild Riders unit.

Also I think the Shield upgrade may be worthwhile giving the WR's a 4+ AS to add to their 6+ WS, making them slightly more survivable.

[Aezeal]

I am a noob WE player but have been using Wild Riders in units of 6 or 7 and find they are glass hammers.

They throw out the wounds but easily die to the return attacks.

One useful trick is placing High Magic Weaver (on horse) in with the Wild Riders after he has cast some low casting spells on turns 1-3 he then adds extra wounds to the Wild Riders unit.

Also I think the Shield upgrade may be worthwhile giving the WR's a 4+ AS to add to their 6+ WS, making them slightly more survivable.

I agree with the glass hammer thing, they are the one unit that always dies in my army. Which basicly means you must only put them against units where they either give a huge strategic advantage OR they can just kill more points on the charge than they are worth themselves. My self I use them to save my archers from anything that passes incoming fire so even if they don't kill enough point that action is usually worth it. (gives archers an extra turn to move away and usually it;s a bit later in the game so it means most archers won't get hit at all).