Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

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Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by unicorn »

RE-posted someone's post from other board:

ok then...let me speak about italian GT rumors...as i've collected an huge amount of them to share with people around the world...this seems the right place

ok,i spoke with Alessio and Jes Goodwin so let's go
!
Chaos Dwarfs: jes said "squat are gone,i've killed them all,personally.Chaos dwarfs?No,they 'll be not squatted..instead in the future you'll see them,in style with hellcannon's crew ones.No more big hats,we will develop them when we will have the time to,and resources"
Dogs of war,Alessio:"sorry but there 're no plans to develop them.We want to make every army particular without criss-crossing between armies.Just like chaos who has been divided in 3, for a reason.DoW were a criss cross army we want no more.Maybe IF we develop an "apocalipse" for whfb we could be reintroduce them..but not anytime soon and not as a stand alone army"
Khermi and beastmen and bretonnia,Alessio:"beasts of chaos will retourn in not so a distant future.The other two armies will wait more instead,they are fine just now,don't need a redone soon"
Lizardmen:will be nasty.Full of new models,more dinosaurs (a more fat stegadon model in the near future).Out in march,no spearhead box but something else.Stegadon will have 3 ways of use: as now, with the Warmachine of gods and with a crew of giant blowpipe skinks (swarm of dards rule..multiple poisoned St3 shooting weapon).No other informations could be said about,sorry
skavenut in 2009 summer.So after them it's time for beasts of chaos,i think.
Ogres: not in the schedule,not a priority for GW to redo my army .When and IF they redo them,probably rhinox riders will be a new type of unit,100% official
Then,i think, the MOST important FACT....they're thinking about a new edition for WHFB,not in a so distant future.
They know how the fifth edition of 40k has been very liked by people,so they want to do the same with WHFB,which instead it's a bit "stuck in marble" cause of rulebook.
they cannot by now expand whfb lin a way like for 40k...so the new edition will be more fun and enjoyable.
In what way?no more only pitched battles,but scenarios like those used in the UK HEAT...with more emphasis on troops, targets to be conquered, table quarters and the like...so a whfb a little bit more like 40k 5th ed.
With also a magic phase in which misscast will be behind the corner...look out at 1 when casting a spell...even with one die...
Those are some ideas they have about to change the rulebook....and if this will be succesfull lik in 40k area...welll, we will se "siege sourcebook"..."apocalypse for whfb" and the like...i'm crossin fingers!
When this will happen? No one told us.....we could guess about it....i'm thinking about 2010...far from now...but not THAT far..but,who kows?Maybe before...
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Mist Walker »

My first reaction to the new brb bit (none of the rest is too much of a surprise to me) was, erm, people in my store don't like large chunks of the new 40k rules. They like the scenarios but not the LoS bits I think.

But the fact that scenarios would be used is fantastic, so long as they balance it out more. Less hero hammer is fantastic... but my favourite part has to be the huge risks of miscast, I wish that I could get away without magic but no, there's all those magic heavy armies, but this would cripple them :sexy:

I'm doubtful about this though
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by unicorn »

Mist Walker wrote:My first reaction to the new brb bit (none of the rest is too much of a surprise to me) was, erm, people in my store don't like large chunks of the new 40k rules. They like the scenarios but not the LoS bits I think.
Here arund, many ppl have also many reservations to new 40k book
but my favourite part has to be the huge risks of miscast, I wish that I could get away without magic but no, there's all those magic heavy armies, but this would cripple them :sexy:
Do not forget that (most probably) at least Lizies and Chaos will still be able to go out magic heavy. Chaos with their ""+-d3 out of mistcast result" and Lizies with their "what is it mistcast?" will still be magic power to recon with. And Empire, with all their "boun bound bound!!!" ;)

Plus I think that such tooned magic will have some adjusted mistcast table as well
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by almundis »

I do like the emphesis being put back into troops, but I myself dislike the new 40k rules, hence my selling off my 40k stuff, so I would hate to see WHFB simplified in such a way. I also hope that they don't do a warhammer 'Apocalypse' as I find that people just start playing that which makes many army types obsolete. My Tau force became unusable as they were not designed for tankbusting- which is all you do in Apocalypse...
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Ramesesis »

We shall have to wait and see.
I personally love the new 40K rules, only having some doubts about the LOS. But then, me and my son already played like the new LOS, so I really do not mind, as long as cover is good.

Yeah, more troops and objectives, less counting VP for each and every mini destroyed. It would indeed benefit high cost low model count armies like ours and Chaos too...

And miscast on every 1.. that sound a bit dangerous... How on Earth would VC cope since they are built around their ability to simply get their magic through. But I like the idea, and I prefer to use lowpowered spells with few dice anyway. And when one think of it, VC could still go for their single dice approach. They would still be able to play the raising game, but would have to be careful about the moving game. But then, they could let the Necro cast with more dice somehow, so the lord can feel a bit safer.

And with miscasts on all 1, there would really be a meaning to bring those miscast protections! And magic could be kept that the new destructive level, since one would really have to think twice about it when you go for it...

The usual turn around plan for editions is really set at 4 years, but GW are not always able to follow that policy. But they did with the last eds of 40K.
I guess WE will not be seen until they release 8th ed. But maybe we get to be first for once! :p
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Pwmf »

I don't like the sound of a new book, I have mixed feelings about 40K (it was mostly changed to sell more, and dumb down) I don't want that to happen to WFB, miscasting on one would have to completely change the magic sytem to the 40K one ie only two die no denfence, which is a rubbish system.
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by unicorn »

Ramesesis wrote:And miscast on every 1.. that sound a bit dangerous... How on Earth would VC cope since they are built around their ability to simply get their magic through. But I like the idea, and I prefer to use lowpowered spells with few dice anyway. And when one think of it, VC could still go for their single dice approach. They would still be able to play the raising game, but would have to be careful about the moving game. But then, they could let the Necro cast with more dice somehow, so the lord can feel a bit safer.
Well, we do not know any details here. Maybe tehre will be more mistcast tables, depending on how many dices you used? Maybe the number of dices will somehow adjust the mistcast result (something like d6+No of used dices)? Maybe for mistcast, you will roll as many dices as you used to cast the spell?
But what I will say we can awaitr for sure is brand new and very different mistcast table. In case there willl be ANY mistcast table and not only some rule like "if casting roll includes one or more 1s, the spell is failed" and nothing more...
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Solan »

I like the 5th edition 40k rules and how they changed the game. Therefore I wouldn't mind seeing a similar mindset applied to Fantasy, however I am not a big fan of oversimplification either. I still think that Fantasy will stay the same at it's core, but I am iffy on the miscast of a single 1......however, this would balance out the armies with a ridiculous spell pool. Would be nice to play without haveng to "need" a couple dispell scrolls.
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Mist Walker »

heh, the 18 power dice vampire army wich averages 3 miscasts a turn on 1 dice invocations. What a strategy. Kill the units to force the vampires to cast spells and risk a miscast.

Perhaps this magic phase is why the tomb kings are delayed so much as they'd end up making a mess of these rules
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by SirSlamb »

ehhh knowing GW mist cast table will be scaled on how many dice/ones are rolled. 1 dice= miscast on 1, 2 dice=miscast on 2 and so on and the miscast table will scale in severity dependant on how many dice are used. I FORSEE IT!
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by ArchMagosAlchemys »

Perhaps we get something like the Screaming Bell chart.
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Tethlis »

If single-dice miscasts are possible, then the miscast table will be very mild. It's likely that the spell will simply fail, rather then there being additional effects. However, this will strengthen the casting ability of one-dice-spell armies like Vampire Counts, while killing armies that need to cast at higher values.
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by unicorn »

Tethlis wrote:If single-dice miscasts are possible, then the miscast table will be very mild. It's likely that the spell will simply fail, rather then there being additional effects. However, this will strengthen the casting ability of one-dice-spell armies like Vampire Counts, while killing armies that need to cast at higher values.
Well, if casted on single dice, the spell will ALWAYS failed on roll of 1 ;)

But what I can think about this "single 1 mistcast" is the mistcast table which is not based on how many dices you used, but on how many 1s you roll... Something like

1x 1 = 1-3 the mage can not cast spells in this turn
1x 1 = 4-6 the spell simply failed

2x 1 = current mistcast table

3+x 1 = badooom! ;)
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by FigureFour »

Tethlis wrote:If single-dice miscasts are possible, then the miscast table will be very mild. It's likely that the spell will simply fail, rather then there being additional effects. However, this will strengthen the casting ability of one-dice-spell armies like Vampire Counts, while killing armies that need to cast at higher values.
Yeah, this would be BETTER then the current situation, since right now a 1 or a 2 automaticly fails.

If there is a semi dangerous effect to a one die miscast Vampire Counts will be pretty boned. At least the way I like to play them.

Come on, summoning a horde of undead is the POINT of playing Vampire Counts. It would be like adding a missfire result when Wood Elves roll a 1 to hit with a bow.
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Tethlis »

Truth be told, I don't think that the casting dynamic really needs to be changed. I think the current incarnation of magic is pretty good, with the rules being clear. I think the issues of abuse come from the armybooks themselves, where older books simply cannot have the casting offense or defense of the new books. The new books themselves are very well prepared to deal with hostile magic. Every new book since the High elves has excellent magic defense:

-High Elves: Banner of the World Dragon, Banner of Arcane Protection, +1 to dispel, Drain Magic, various arcane items, reduced cost on dispel scrolls.

-Vampire Counts: Everyone in the army is a caster, Balefire on Corpse Carts, ability to resurrect all casualties from magical attacks.

-Daemons: Solid ward save that works against magic attacks, Standard of Sundering to destroy enemy magic, Tzeentch abilities that stop magic, Core choices that boost the dispel pool.

-Dark Elves: Easy access to MR(1) talismans, Ring of Hotek, Malekith's Spelleater Shield, +1 dispel dice, ability to make casters forget spells.

I've said this before, but we're entering a new realm of Warhammer Fantasy where magic is an inevitable part of the game and can't be stopped. I don't necessarily think this is a problem, provided that all armies have something to slow down/interfere with the storm of spells that some armies can cast. Right now, some armies have that. Many do not. Armies shouldn't be able to shut down EVERY spell that's cast, because that's not fair to the armies that need magic.
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by unicorn »

New things about 8ed:
8th edition
At the moment it looks like 8th edition will hit us medio 2010, with a release schedule probably similar to what Warhammer 40K had in 2008 - a new rulebook in july(ish) and a new starter set in september(ish). Most army books will have been released by that time, the starter set will be four years old (common lifespan for an edition of the core games is 4 years) and GW will likely want to put out a new, fresh one to attract new customers and tempt the veterans with deals that are "just too good not to get, even if I don't play either of the two armies". It is important to understand that new editions are primarily made to keep the excitement about the game high and NOT primarily about balancing anything. So expect rule tweaks to make the game more immersive and intuitve first and foremost.
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Dilgar »

unicorn wrote:New things about 8ed:
8th edition
It is important to understand that new editions are primarily made to keep the excitement about the game high and NOT primarily about balancing anything. So expect rule tweaks to make the game more immersive and intuitve first and foremost.
Well this has been known, but to go out and say...

"yeah we will continue to make over powered stuff even if we know it will be unbeatable" :lol:

...maybe not the best way to go. Is GW not realizing that some of there customers are getting older and do not want a game were there is minimal tactics involved since the other army has 1000 dices vs your 10... <.<

I get the business part, I really do, but are the customers that are 12-16 of age really those who buy the most GW products, or are we simply getting to dumb to use tactics, and GW knows it :p
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Maeglin »

I do not want Fantasy to go the same way as 40k, while yes in i enjoy playing scenarios, i also like playing pitched battles. Contesting objectives all the time wouldn't feel right in warhammer. Plus have you ever tired to shift 40 zombies or slaves as a wood elf player? Not fun and definatly not what asrai are about. Awarding VPs for table quarters would be much inkeeping with the warhammer vibe, aslong as they went hand in hand with VPs for destroyed units.

As for magic, yes it needs to be toned down or controlled in some armies (they know who they are...) but a change in the system won't do that. Only a change in the armies themselves will as Tethlis has said.
For those who don't like magic i'm sorry, its a fantasy game and that for me means having a little magic in my life. ok sometimes alot of magic

Anyway those are my feelings on the subject, Maeglin
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Telcontar »

Dilgar wrote: I get the business part, I really do, but are the customers that are 12-16 of age really those who buy the most GW products, or are we simply getting to dumb to use tactics, and GW knows it :p

Well, I'm sixteen and I can surely say they are not :p


It's a shame that Warhammer is going that way. And the fact that they even admit that they want to go that way doesn't make it better.
I think they want to get some new people playing with the though the older and more veteran players will hold on.
Business is important, it's true, after all it's still a company, but I don't think the game needs to become like this to make that business run.
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Aryel »

Dogs of war,Alessio:"sorry but there 're no plans to develop them.We want to make every army particular without criss-crossing between armies.Just like chaos who has been divided in 3, for a reason.DoW were a criss cross army we want no more.Maybe IF we develop an "apocalipse" for whfb we could be reintroduce them..but not anytime soon and not as a stand alone army"
All I got from this part was "The fanbase know <b>[censored]</b>, even if they love and want to see a DOW army (and you own pretty much all the dow units), we know best and will give them what we think it's more 'fun'. Now, shut up and do what we say".

Geesh, and people wonder why I don't play anymore this game and I hesitate to come back.

In all honesty, I'm not impressed (I haven't been impressed in a long time) the way GW is heading with his policy.

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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Maeglin »

Arghhh i think i skipped the DoW section in selfdefence! How dare they call it a criss cross army? All they have to do is remove DoW from other lists and that problem is fixed. Yes you could have men, dwarfs, halflings and ogres all in the same army, but WoC can still have men, ogres, dragon ogres, giants. trolls, spawn and chaos dwarfs!
The enjoyment of playing DoW is having a mercenary army with your own flavour and history without being tied down to any particular allignment. Yes DoW were abused by players to fill gaps in their armies, but don't persecute us all for others failings GW!
Ok rant over...........for now :ninja:
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Ramesesis »

Oh, så I should start to gear up for a new ed in a year or so... Hmm...
Well, I for one MISS the 6th ed scenarios. I hate fighting all them pitched battles all the time.
Sure, they are fun too, but in the end, asrais are not always the best in pitched, especially not against VC, so variety that means the opponent, neither you, can be sure of exactly how the engagement will look is fun.

I like the new 40K. Why? Because now taking troop choices and center around them is a sensible and viable strategy. I love to see the core troops increasing in value and importance for all Warhammer armies, and not be just something that the cat dragged in!

The only thing that can make this come true with the current game mechanics is to go the 40K way.
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by dilba »

I don´t like the 40K rules and it´s beacuse even if I think 40K is fun to play sometimes it´s more
of a kid game.
It is not so much tactic like in WFB where you have the flank chagres and charges responses and so on.

If they change WFB and make it easier like 40K everyone I know will stop play WFB.

But since GW want to make money they will probably make WFB easier so they sell more.
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Beithir Seun »

I don't like the new 40K rules either. I think GW have the right idea, but have gone the wrong way about it. Instead of forcing people to take Troop selections as the only unit that can capture objectives, make Troops better so that players have more of an incentive to take them. I agree with Rammie that the focus of every army should be on it's core Troops but this is just forcing people to play the way GW want them to play, which goes against everything I enjoy about the game.

If they do take Warhammer the same way, I'll just stop playing.
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Re: Close future of WFB in official "rumors"

Post by Telcontar »

If they do take Warhammer the same way, I'll just stop playing.
If GW continues like this, I think It might lose a lot of it's players like this.
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