DE Spearhead- At last!

[almundis]

that's why the battalion comes with 28 warriors

[Mist Walker]

you can't really call an assassin a character any more though, seeing as they don't take any slots up

[matthew_swifty]

you can't really call an assassin a character any more though, seeing as they don't take any slots up

Really? I thought there was the unit upgrade one and the normal hero one. I haven't read the new rules though so I am probably wrong.

[Mist Walker]

Well you could call the her one a character, but if you could field him (the model) not as a charcter and so have more slots.

[Black Arrow]

that's why the battalion comes with 28 warriors

Does anyone know what the contents of the new Dark Elf battalion will be??

[unicorn]

Well, this seems to be the final version of rumors:

Eternal Hatred: Dark Elves hate everyone. Against High Elves this hatred continues in subsequent rounds of combat. Then each unit which is affected by it has Eternal Hatred marked in their individual rules. Black Guard and Harpies don't have it listed as one of their special rules, ergo - they don't hate people.

Khainite: Non-Khainite characters are unable to join Khainite units. Khainite characters are free to join non-Khainite units however. (Replaces Sect enmity). Khainite units are Execs and WE. Khainite characters are Death Hag, Assassin, Crone Hellebron, Tullaris and Shadowblade.

Repeater Crossbows: 24" range, 2x multiple shots, Strength 3, Armour Piercing

Repeater Handbows: 8” range, 2x Multiple shots, Strength 3. May always stand and shoot, no modifiers for long range or moving. Can take 2 for 4x multiple shots. It does not have the "Pistol" rule, so doesn't count as a Hand Weapon. So it's a choice between shooting and 2A in combat. It may be able to stand and shoot, move and fire etc but is not explicitly a pistol. It's a handbow. Access to Rhb is available to Corsairs, Dreadlord, Masters and Assassins.

Sea Dragon Cloaks have not changed.

Last edited by Calisson on Thu Jun 26, 2008 11:23 am; edited 2 times in total
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Magic

Dark Elf Sorceresses are able to use Dark Magic or Lores of Shadow , Death , Fire and Metal .

Dark Elf Sorceresses no longer gain +1 to cast .

Dark Elf Sorceresses can use unlimited number of power dice to cast a spell.

* Power of Darkness FREE SPELL * 4+ to cast, generates D3+1 Power Dice that can only be used by caster. Any dice unused cause Strength 4 hit on the caster.
[bernh: PoD isn't a spell of Dark Lore, it's a spell that knows each Dark Elf wizard (even Malekith).]

Dark Magic:

1 – Chillwind 5+ D6 Strength 4 hits. Any casualties prevent shooting.

2- Doombolt 6+ D6 Strength 5 hits. Doombolt rumour was false. It's exactly as it is now. 18" range.

3 – Word of Pain 8+ [bernh: 7+ ] Same as current

4 – Blade wind 8+ 3D6 WS4 [bernh: S4 ] attacks on unit within range [bernh: 24" ].

5 – Soul Stealer 10+ 12” range, Each model takes Strength 2 hit, No Armour Saves. Wounds go to caster (no more than double).

6 – Black Horror 11+ Large template, Strength test or take a wound [bernh: 18" range ]

Last edited by Calisson on Thu Jun 26, 2008 11:24 am; edited 6 times in total

Magic items
Lots of new items! There's about 4 pages of magic items in the book

Common Items : Sword of Striking , Sword of Battle , Sword of Might :15pts Biting Blade: 5pts Staff of Sorcery: 35pts Power Stone: 20pts

Magic Weapons :

Executioner's Axe Same as in 6th Edition, still struggling to see the use of it.

Blade of Ruin (50pts) Same as in 6th Edition

Chillblade (50pts) Back from 6th Edition, and much improved. Each hit makes the target take a toughness test or take a wound with no armour save. If a model takes any wounds they cannot attack that turn.

Web of Shadows (50pts) Same as in 6th Edition but with a points increase from 25pts to 50pts.I'm fairly sure the Web of Shadows doesn't ignore armour saves. It was pretty much just a glance as the entry seemed to be a copy-paste from the 6th edition book. [bernh: one use 2D6 S3 hits on one model in contact without carrying out wounds on other models ]

Hydra Blade (35pts) Same as in 6th Edition, but with a points decrease from 50pts to 35pts

Caledor's Bane [bernh: ( 35pts )] +3 strength on the charge (NB. It is not stated as a Lance, so can be used on foot - possibly will be errata'd). Ignores Scaly skin saves

Lifetaker (30pts) 30" range, Strength 4, 3x multiple shots. Always hits on a 2+ (no re-roll to wound).

<<[bernh Dagger of Hotek ] >> ( 30 pts ) Magic Dagger which can be combined with normal hand weapons for an additional attack. Grants the bearer the ASF rule.

Crimson Death (25pts) Same as in 6th Edition, just with a points decrease from 35pts to 25pts : always S6, two handed

Below the Crimson death were two or three other cheap items who's exact nature eludes me.

One was a 25pts Lance with Killing blow , [bernh: beastmaster weapon with always S5 attacks with AP ] and I recall another Lance (whose exact effect escapes me). I think one may have been a magic great weapon [bernh: with armor piercing ].

[bernh: Whip 25pts 'always Str 5, no matters anything', with AP ]

There was no GoP weapon.



Magic Armours :

Armour of Living Death (60pts) Almost exactly the same as in 6th Edition, but with a points decrease. Added effect that at the start of the battle you roll a dice - on a 1 he is subject to stupidity for the game.

Armour of Eternal Servitude (35pts) Heavy Armour, Regeneration

Shield of Ghrond It's back! Same as in 6th Edition

Armour of Darkness (25pts) Gives the beaer a 1+ armour save, that cannot be improved. No Shield component

Blood Armour Same as in 6th Edition

[bernh:] Sea dragon cloak (25 pts) halving Str of all ranged attacks

Talismans :

Black Amulet (70pts) Gives the bearer a 4+ Ward Save. In Close Combat any succesful ward saves reflect the attack doing 1 wound with no saves.

<< Reverse Ward Save >> (35pts) Gives the wearer a ward save. When wounded roll a dice - if the dice roll is under the strength of the attack the wound is negated. A 6 always fails.

Ring of Hotek [bernh: (25pts) ] Same effect as in 6th Edition, but with a range of 12". [bernh: the Ring of Hotek now goes off not only on wizards casting spells withing it's range, but also when any target - friend or foe - within 12" of the bearer is being targeted by spells as well ]

Null Shard (15pts) Gives the bearer Magic Resistance 1. Multiple Null Shards can be bought and the effect stacks.

Seal of Ghrond (25pts) Same as in 6th Edition [bernh: stays in Talisman , not Enchanted as Milney said]

I also remember another "One Use Only" item which made the bearer and his unit ItP until the end of the turn as well. But for the life of me I can't remember the cost or it's name. I think it fell in between the Hydra Teeth and the Black Dragon Egg in terms of price. Believe Enchanted item. [bernh: It's cost is 25 pts and it not one use only! Also it's a talisman , not enchanted item, giving ItP for bearer and unit - ItP don't prevent stupidity, don't forget.]

the Ring of Darkness is back - [bernh: 40pts ] but it's effect is inbuilt - no bound spell needed to be cast. However the exact effect isn't quite the same. I can't remember it's exact details, but suffice to say it acts to reduce the opponents chance to hit you. Believe its Enchanted. [bernh: WS and BS when hit bearer is halved with rounding fractions up. And it is talisman .]

[bernh: Crown of Black Iron (COBI) is NOT in the new book anymore .]



Enchanted Items :

Deathmask (50pts) Same as in 6th Edition but moved from Talisman to Enchanted

Hydra's Teeth Gives the bearer 5 teeth. Any number of these can be thrown, each one causing D3 WS2 S3 attacks on the target unit.

Black Dragon Egg (30pts) One use only. Eaten at the start of either player's turn. Gives the user Toughness 6 and a Breath Weapon attack until the end of the turn. It's an enchanted item, one use only.

Potion of Strength One use only. Gives the bearer +3 strength until the end of the turn. Potion of strength was about 30pts if I recall correctly.

[bernh: here are 'one use only' enchanted item, that give fear to bearer and unit. Also 25 pts .]

The Crystal of Midnight is still there [bernh: it's an enchanted i tem, not Arcane as Milney thought]

the new banners are pretty damn impressive. Pretty much everything is covered - extra attacks, fear, ASF, armour piercing attacks. We actually have choice of suitable banners now

Banner of Nagarythe - 125pts Same as in 6th Edition, but points cost reduced slightly.

Hydra Banner - [bernh: 75pts ] Same as in 6th Edition.

Dread Banner - 40pts Same as in 6th Edition, but points cost reduced.

Standard of Slaughter Same as in 6th Edition, though I think it is no longer only on the first charge [Calisson: it was not already].

ASF Banner [Name not remembered] - [bernh: 35pts , not 25pts] Grants the unit the Always Strike First rule

AP Banner [Name not remembered] - [bernh: 25pts ] Gives the unit the Armour Piercing special rule

Please remember that this list is not conclusive as there were at least 3 more banners whose exact effects I cannot remember. I didn't see any banner for a 1+ armour save for a turn.

[bernh: Only 2 more banners - one use coldblooded and corsair banner .

Cold Blooded - just one use cold blooded effect for stupidy test for 15 pts. Banner gives possibility one time in game to make stupidity test with 'cold blooded' rule (roll 3 dice and take 2 lowest).

Corsair only banner just give them frenzy (and +1 attack as one of the frenzy effects) - 25 pts. ]

Gifts of Khaine :

Hag Queens, Assassins and Witch Elf Hags have access to the Gifts of Khaine list, which has been expanded and recosted somewhat. As has been mentioned previously, Assassins can now take up to 75pts from the Gifts of Khaine list. Witch Elf Hags can take up to 25pts from the Gifts of Khaine list. [bernh: Assassin and Hag can take ONLY Gifts of Khaine.
All other characters can take ONLY magic items. I.e. none is able to combine items with gifts, unless he is a special character .]

Like now, Gifts can be taken multiple times in an army with the exception of two which are noted to follow the special rules for magic items. Magic weapons cannot make poisoned attacks; etc.

Venom Sword - 75pts (1 per army!) Exactly the same as it is now (but is no longer available as a Magic weapon).

Cloak [Name not remembered] - 30pts (1 per army!).Contains a bound spell Steed of Shadows from the Lore of Shadows. Power Level 3. Also it's worth noting that the item doesn't specify anything about the bound spell only affecting the wearer. Just that it contains it as a bound spell. The item description just says the cloak contains the Bound Spell Cloak of Shadows at Power Level 3. So you can also use your assassin to throw other characters around should the need arise.

The rest of the Gifts of Khaine are similar to the current list, but changes and additions I will list below:

Shuriken [Name not remembered] - 30pts Gives the bearer ranged attacks with the following profile; Thrown 8" range, Strength As user +1, 3x Multiple shots.

Rune of Khaine - 25pts Gives the model +D3 attacks each round of combat.

Black Lotus - 15pts Allows the model to re-roll 1s rolled to wound

Dark Venom - 10prs If the model kills an opponent in a challenge, all wounds inflicted are doubled for combat resolution.

N.B. Manbane (same as current), Black Lotus and Dark Venom replace the models base Poisoned Attacks

Last edited by Calisson on Wed Jun 25, 2008 12:28 pm; edited 4 times in total
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Calisson
Corsair

Malekith : The Claw is gone. Instead he's strength 5 basic. Destroyer is there, and once a round of combat can suck a magic level or destroy an item (randomly decided).2+ 'mundane' ward is still there, and can still only take 1 wound per hit. He also has the nifty spell eater shield, which aswell as boosting his normal armour save to 4+ gives him MR(2). If a spell targetted at him is dispelled (by rolling dice - not a scroll) then the caster takes a strength 6 hit for each dice used to cast the spell! Bound spell users suffer a single strength 6 hit. The Circlet now generates an extra powerdice and an extra dispel dice. Costing 600pts on foot he's still a hefty investment, though still damn cool. Malekith is still an imposing general figure, and now any unit within 12" of him is immune to panic. Malekith can now be mounted either on foot, on a Cold One, in a Cold One Chariot or on a Black Dragon (takes up a hero slot).
[bernh: With Destroyer (Malekith's weapon), if you wound, on a 4+ you destroy some magic. Randomize between magic levels and magic items if enemy has both. Then randomize the items themselves (all categories affected). ]

Morathi is a powerful sorceress and can take an extra arcane and enchanted item (as well as a choice between two different magic weapons). She still gets the old +1 to all her casts and knows all 6 Dark Magic spells, as well as her old special rules.
[bernh: Only mounted. 455pts for whole model .]

Crone Hellebron (If taken, Witch Elves count as Core) She is interesting - not my cup of tea but with her Gifts of Khaine and Strength 10 attacks will be a hit amongst some Khaine fanatics. Without being able to recall her exact stat-line I can say she is a close combat beast, equipped with two magic weapons (which do combine for +1 attack). The Parrying blade reduces the enemies attacks by one, and her other sword gives her attacks strength 10. Her Parry Blade just lowers the enemies attacks by one now, she can't use it multiple times like she used to do. Though she does have some Gifts of Khaine, one of which I think is Hand of Khaine for a potential -2 attacks. You can still mount her on a manticore, she can be on foot, and she can be with a CoB. She is evil and will kick a Dreadlord's ass if she get's the charge. She has the potential to have 10 s10 attacks! Downside is she doesn't have any save. [bernh: 350pts ]

Unique characters (Heroes)

Malus Darkblade : He's still a monster in combat (and a mere Hero choice!). However he does cost around 275pts. Malus is pretty much the same, but Spites ability to negate Stupidity in the unit will probably make him a must have Hero in tournament lists. Spites ability really does negate COK"s stupidity in the unit.

Shadowblade (other Hero special character) costs 300pts! Shadowblade is still the same as before, same Magic Items (potion of strength and Hearth of Woe). He can still hide in the enemies army, and is now the only assassin who can scout. Shadowblade is still Shadowblade - now a legal 300pts super-assassin who'll probably grace more than his fair share of power lists for gutting enemy generals on turn 2.

Tullaris 95pts Executioner character makes his unit cause Fear. [bernh: He is 'champion in all regards' (including stats) and very similiar to Regiments of Renown comanders. He doesn't take a slot, can't leave unit and can't be a general .] [Horsehead: Tullaris replaces the draich-master (champion) in a unit of execs. He cannot be given magic items. He comes with the Blade of Har Ganeth and heavy armour. He has the same stat line as the draich-master except he has 2 additional rules sacred slaughterer and tullaris the dreaded]

Kouran 75pts Black Guard character has Crimson Death, and makes his unit unbreakable. [bernh: He is 'champion in all regards' (including stats) and very similiar to Regiments of Renown comanders. He doesn't take a slot, can't leave unit and can't be a general .][Horsehead: He has the crimson death and the armour of grief. Same stats as the Tower Master .]

Lokhir Fellheart , [Horsehead: 250pts ws6, str4,w2, i7, at3, ld9. The same stat line as a master ]
Admiral Squidface, the terror-causing, regenerating acrobatic (he can leap to anywhere that is in base contact with the enemy each turn) with his potential massive numer of attacks will suit alot of offensive lists.
Lokir Felheart, Captain of the Tower of Blessed Dread, reported from warseer (not denied my Milney), has red blades, giving him + atk for each rank the unit he is fighting has, he regens, causes terror, he has an ability allowing him to move from combat, to anywhere else in combat as long as he is base to base with an enemy afterwards (same combat), when his unit runs an enemy down you are awarded 2x VPs and keep them even if lokhir is killed. Lohkir Fellheart wears the helm of the kraken which makes him cause terror. He has a rule where any enemy overrun (possibly by his unit, can't recall) is taken as slaves and is worth double VPs. He wears a Sea Dragon Cloak. The special character is not anyone you have heard of before, in any previously published GW material.
[bernh: He is a hero and can be a general. There is a lot of fluff about him in the book.
He can leap in beginning of combat phase only in contact with enemy inside same unit. He can't leap if in challenge. He always gains attack bonus for enemy rows.]

Lords : • Malekith • Morathi • Crone Hellebron • Dreadlord • High Sorceress

Dreadlord . now pretty impressive selection of mundane and mount options available to the Dreadlord and Master characters.
Dreadlord From rumors not denied my Milney: - same profile, may be +5 points;- can mount: Black Dragon, Manticore, Dark Pegasus, Cold One, Dark Steed or a CO Chariot

High Sorceress : has also seen a slight price hike

Heroes: • Malus • Shadowblade • Lokhir Fellheart • Sorceress • “Master” • Hag Queen

The Master [Horsehead: ws6, str4,w2, i7, at3, ld9 ] can ride the manticore, think of it as the noble - only able to get weird and wonderful weapons like twin Repeater Handbows, the funky Beastermaster's Bane (handweapon that is armour piercing) etc. Both Masters and Hag Queens can be BSB. The Beastmaster is gone. No longer there as either a character or an upgrade. Instead the new "Master" is the new generic Hero with more upgrades than you can shake a stick at. Now pretty impressive selection of mundane and mount options available to the Dreadlord and Master characters. Able to make effectively a "cheap" Beastmaster. [Horsehead: can ride anything except a dragon: manticore, dark pegasus, cold one, dark steed, and cold one chariot. The cold one chariot is listed as one of his mounts for 90 points and it says in the mounts section that it replaces 1 crew .]

Sorceress : As for the points costs of our Sorceresses, they've gone up. The Sorceress is 100pts. Our level upgrades have in turn however gone down to the usual 35pts a level sort of offsetting the minor price hike.

Assassin : Neither Core, nor Hero. 90pts, always hidden in unit (pretty much any DE infantry). Has poisoned attacks, 75pts allowed from Gifts of Khaine, Additional Hand Weapon 6pts, Repeater handbow 9pts. 1 per unit. There's pretty much no infantry unit which he can't be in now - they've expanded the list extensively. They just have to be assigned to hide in a unit before the game (and only one can hide in each unit) which is why people were reffering to them as a "Unit Upgrade" as effectively you have to have 1 unit for each assassin. The rules for the Assassins don't go into detail about it other than saying that they can hide in a unit of Shades, and seeing as they are not "deployed" I see no reason why it would stop the unit from scouting. Once revealed however they are free to act as characters and can run around to thier hearts content. They can leave the unit they were hidden in. Calling them an "Upgrade" is a bit of a misnomer - they still counts as "Characters" in the rules. They take up neither Core nor Hero slots, the only "limitation" is that they must start the game hidden in a friendly Dark Elf infantry unit (a list of units is provided in the entry), and that no more than one assassin can be hidden in any one unit. (they have to be hidden in a unit, hence why people say they are 'upgrades', but have thier own seperate army list entry which they are bought from. Which means that in a tournament or other formalised list situation you could change the unit they are hiding in between games - unlike goblin fanatics which are fixed). And yes, the Assassins are still WS9 S4. The stat-line is exactly the same, they just got cheaper! It's possible to get an Assassin running around with 3x BS9 S7 shots a turn with the right load out (depending on target). Fancy popping that War Alter on turn 1? A normal assassin on a good day can now pop out and rack up 7 attacks on his own! Assassins cannot take Magic Items anymore. [bernh: ASF always. He can be challenged. ]

Death Hag =Hag Queen was 90pts as far as I can remember, though I may have confused it with something else. Both Masters and Hag Queens can be BSB, she's the only BSB who can join Khainite units. She can't wear armour afaik, but then again she can take Gifts of Khaine for Dance of Doom. She doesn't have to buy a Cauldron - you can buy her without the cauldron if you want a BSB. There's no 0-1 limitation on Death Hags. Have one as a BSB and one on a Cauldron.
[bernh: 50 pts of Gifts of Khaine allowed ]. [Horsehead: Death Hags, as far as I can see they DON'T have ASF. They have 4 special rules: eternal hatred, frenzy, khainite, and poison attacks. 2 hw's, up to 50 pts of gifts of khaine. That's it. Stat line is the almost the same as the master, ws 6, str4, t3, I8, at3, ld9 .] [bernh: she can lose her frenzy ]

Cauldron of Blood (character mount)
110pts mount for Hag Queen. All Khainite units within 12” are stubborn. Each turn 1 unit within 24" can gain an ability from the following: • +1 Attack • 5+ Ward Save • Killing Blow.
CoB effects work automatically and cannot be stopped/dispelled and lasts until the start of the next DE players turn. States so explicitly in the book. No tests needed. Just pick a unit in range and off you go. No longer do Witch Elves gain a 5+ Ward from being in proximity. Those rules have been replaced with the 1 choice of power a turn, and the Stubborn for Khainite units within 12".As for the Cauldron of Blood, yes the Death Hag (Hag hero character) has to join it as it is her 'mount'. She forms a War Machine unit with it and cannot leave (as far as I could see in the rules). The Hag and Cauldron form a unit of their own, and counts as a War Machine so is unable to join units. It still has the 4+ ward save though and any hits randomised onto the cauldron are still discounted so it's a hardy contraption to say the least. The Cauldron still has it's old rules of goodness (Terror, 4+ ward, etc.), there was no explicit rule stating the ward save was still only against shooting - though I may have omitted that. And it still comes with its crew, though it no longer has an upgradeable Hag (but it comes with a Death Hag). The Cauldron of Blood is a "War Machine" (it even has the War Machine special rule in its bestiary section). As such it may move as fast as its crew (so 5") is unable to march, and cannot join units.




Other Character Mounts:

The Dragon is pretty much as it is now, same statline. The breath attack is now Strength 3, but the Ld test taken in order to charge next turn is now taken at -3. As far as I can remember it was 3+ Scaly Skin Save.

Manticore : The Manticore is 200pts if I remember correctly. Still a mount option. Each turn has to pass a Ld test or becomes frenzied. If rider is killed it automatically suffers the “Raaargh” result giving him frenzy and hatred – no test needed. the Manticore is not a rare choice, it's still just a mount which takes up an additional Hero slot [bernh: ...when taken by a Master, not by a Dreadlord ].

Dark Pegasus : Sorceresses can now be mounted on Dark Pegasus.

Cold One : no change mentioned
Dark Steed : no change mentioned
Cold One Chariot : only change mentioned is that it does NOT anymore take up a special slot if taken by Malekith, Dreadlord or Master .

Core troops

Warriors 6pts basic, Shields (1pt), can have magic banner (25pts). the changes in cost to warriors, and most importantly the option to give them a magic banner (which we lacked previously) means that for a pretty decent price we can get a unit capable of throwing out a +6 SCR (3 ranks, Banner, Warbanner, Outnumber).

Multi-Crossbowmen : 10pts basic, Shields (1pt). AP for Repeater Crossbows. [bernh: Only mundane banner .]

Corsairs : will be 10pts basic, with 2 hand weapons. 1 hand weapon can be exchanged for a handbow for free. [bernh: only the unit champion ] can get a 2nd Handbow at 3pts. no shield option. Fleeing enemies roll 3D6 and use lowest. [bernh: All corsairs units can have magic banner (25pts)].

Dark Riders : 17pts basic, Repeater crossbows (5pts), Shields (1pt – no fast cavalry). Herald has BS5 and A2!

Harpies are 11 points. Harpies as mentioned have no limitation on the number of units that can be taken, and are a Core choice (though do not count towards minimum Core). The unit size has also decreased slightly from 5-15 to 5-10. Stat-lines remain the same (2 Str3 attacks and Ld6) but now can use the general's Ld and do not cause panic in Dark Elves (still Panic Harpies).


Special Choice (all rumored minimum unit: 5+)

Shades : 16pts, WS and BS5, can be upgraded to have 2 hand weapons or a great weapon. Can also take light armour ( 1pt ). Shades have gone up in price, but remember they are now WS and BS5, with the Bloodshade being BS6. Very tasty. [bernh: GW for +2 pts, 2nd HW +1 pts , these options allow them to keep their crossbow .]

Cold One Chariots 100pts, T5 3+ Armour Save, Ld 9. Cold Ones still have just 1 attack. [bernh: S4 and I6 for charioteers. RxBs are free .]

Witch Elves : Khainites 10pts, WS4, I6. 2 hand weapons, frenzied, poisoned attacks. their magic banner cap is 25pts. [bernh: unit size 5+ ]

Executioners : Khainites 12pts, S4, Great Weapons, Killing Blow. The stat-line for the Executioners has remained the same, with the exception of Strength, which has increased to 4 basic. They are equipped with Great Weapons in their Unit Entry (the term Driach doesn't make an appearence apart from for fluff). They then also have the following special rules: Eternal Hatred and Killing Blow. So they are universally S6 with Killing Blow - but strike last. However the unit is allowed to take a Magic Banner up to 25pts. Which is eerily the exact cost of the ASF banner. [according to bernh: unfortunately, the ASF banner cost is 35pts so execs need the BSB to take it] Executioner character makes his unit cause Fear. [bernh: unit size 5+ ] Can take Tullaris for 95pts as champ, he makes his unit cause Fear. He is 'champion in all regards' (including stats) and very similiar to Regiments of Renown comanders. He doesn't take a slot, can't leave unit and can't be a general.]

Black Guard 13pts, Stubborn, ItP, Ld 9. Black Guard do have 2 Attacks. Tower master (Unit Champions from Black Guard) can take Magic items up to 25pts (as well as the units Magic Banner allowance [bernh: 50pts ]).The Warrior-Elite rule replaces Eternal Hatred. The new rule however is just a straight up re-roll for all misses every round - no need to pursue. Strength 3, with Halberds - but 2A each. With Re-rolls to hit (every round of combat for being Warrior-Elite rather than Eternal Hatred), Stubborn, ItP and Ld9. All for 13pts? Tasty. Black Guard character has Crimson Death, and makes his unit unbreakable. [bernh: unit size 5-20 ] Can take Kouran for 75pts as champ, with Crimson Death, he makes his unit unbreakable. He is 'champion in all regards' (including stats) and very similiar to Regiments of Renown comanders. He doesn't take a slot, can't leave unit and can't be a general.]


ColdOnes Knights : 27pts, 1A, Stupidity. Cold Ones still have just 1 attack. Dread knight (unit Champions from Cold One Knights) can take Magic items up to 25pts (as well as the units Magic Banner allowance [bernh: up to 50pts ]). [bernh: Strenght 4 base and I6]


Rare

Reaper Bolt Thrower . 100pts, 2-for-1, no longer suffers -1 for multiple shots. Under the old rules the Bolt Thrower technically still suffered -1 for multiple shots (though many RAW players debated this). The new rules however specify that the Reaper Bolt Throwers are accurate and as such don't suffer a -1 for firing multiple bolts.

War Hydra : 175pts, 5 wounds, Regeneration. Breath weapon has strength equal to number of wounds left. The Hydra is still T5 and has a 4+ Scaly Skin save. The Handlers are pretty much the same. However the rules for randomising the hits changed significantly. Basically if a shot randomises, it auto-hits the Hydra. They may also have the new Beastmaster weapon (which is a hand weapon - so can be combined with other hand weapons - that has armour piercing). The decrease in cost and increase in strength of the breath weapon, aswell as Regen make it pretty solid choice now. Hydra apprentices aren't as vulnerable as you might think. They still have the old rules (such as if a model can attack either it has to choose the Hydra). As for the nature of the regen save - it's just a normal regen save. The rumours of the extra head for each save made was false - the only thing tied into its wounds is the strength of the breath attack which is equal to the number of wounds left.

Hag can be BSB..?
Assassins sounds crazy - 3 BS9 S7 shots per turn? You can have let's say 4 or 5 of them on the table? Lol... But I can not see how he get that S7 - manabane was bnounded to CC weapon and it's target, if I am right..? But even S5 is crazy...
Black guard sound silly per 13 pts, if it have no 0-1. Still T3 AS5+ targets to shooting and magic, that can be the way...
That arcane knife +1PD AFTER you roll your casting dices per sacrifice model can lead to some nasty magic phases too.
Reverse ward save or heavy armor with regen where discussed already.

[matthew_swifty]

Cool!

I don't play Dark Elves but I like all that new stuff. Now truly all the elven armies shall be feared!!

Maybe the resident dark elf player will stop complaining for once about his army and be able to give me a good fight for once...

[almundis]

Also High sorcs can ride B. Dragons apparently. Which I intend to make full use of

[unicorn]

Also High sorcs can ride B. Dragons apparently. Which I intend to make full use of

How? You wish to have dragon in CC, right? And you don't wish to expose your High sorc to any shooting or other stuff of danger, no?
Do you have any plan?

[almundis]

All is explained briefly here. It gives you a gist of the hell it can unleash. Though obviously i will switch the B. Dragon for a peggy if i really need extra troops.

http://www.druchii.net/viewtopic.php?t=55310&highlight=

[Mist Walker]

Those shades are stupid. Same stats as waywatchers but with options and 8pts cheaper .

[almundis]

Haha, isn't it ironic that now WE players are whining about other armies How the tables turn eh

[unicorn]

Those shades are stupid. Same stats as waywatchers but with options and 8pts cheaper .

Yes, but no lethal shot rule, no forest stalking, -1 to hit when moving; and hand crossbow, so 2 shots, -1 to hit, armorpiercing and 24"

I don't care to compare shades to waywatchers, but if you really wish, try to compare them to our 18 pts Scouts

[Beithir Seun]

Those shades are stupid. Same stats as waywatchers but with options and 8pts cheaper .

Yes, but no lethal shot rule, no forest stalking, -1 to hit when moving; and hand crossbow, so 2 shots, -1 to hit, armorpiercing and 24"

I don't care to compare shades to waywatchers, but if you really wish, try to compare them to our 18 pts Scouts

When I play with Dark Elves, I'm forever cursing that my Shades are hitting on 5s or 6s - Waywatchers really are a godsend, even if they are 8pts more.

[Mist Walker]

Those shades are stupid. Same stats as waywatchers but with options and 8pts cheaper .

Yes, but no lethal shot rule, no forest stalking, -1 to hit when moving; and hand crossbow, so 2 shots, -1 to hit, armorpiercing and 24"

I don't care to compare shades to waywatchers, but if you really wish, try to compare them to our 18 pts Scouts

17 points, which are already overpriced so they're completely and utterly rubbish compared to shades

oh, and who says you have to use multi shot?

[unicorn]

Those shades are stupid. Same stats as waywatchers but with options and 8pts cheaper .

Yes, but no lethal shot rule, no forest stalking, -1 to hit when moving; and hand crossbow, so 2 shots, -1 to hit, armorpiercing and 24"

I don't care to compare shades to waywatchers, but if you really wish, try to compare them to our 18 pts Scouts

17 points, which are already overpriced so they're completely and utterly rubbish compared to shades

oh, and who says you have to use multi shot?

17, my bad. Bad day or something like that
Multishot... Noone force you to use it, but statistically it is always better and more profitable to use it that not to use it, at least as long as you are not hitting on 7+ with it

[Minsc]

Shades with adhw will cost 17 pts each.
Waywatchers costs 24 pts
Shades got Hatred and better WS. (I guess that the new RxB > Longbow as well.)
Waywatchers get Lethal Shot, Forest Stalkers and no penalty for moving and shooting. (wich pointwise is worth alot!)

Shades are better at fighting, but Waywatchers are superior at shooting and doing everything that Scouts are supposed to do.
Although I think WW's are slightly overpriced (22ppm imo), they far outshine Shades in the Scout-role.

Also, one should never compare across the armies; How many different Skirmishers does DE have, and how many does WE have?

[Tethlis]

Also, one should never compare across the armies; How many different Skirmishers does DE have, and how many does WE have?

Agreed. Besides, Dark Elves truly need their Special choices, and are vulnerable to warmachines like noone's business. Chillwind, harpies and Shades should go a long way towards helping that out.

[Overmind]

I believe someone asked for these earlier:

Battalion Box:
5 COld One Knights
20 Corsairs
16 Crossbowmen
12 Spearmen


The sorting of wariors in the answer confuses people as they wonder how the totals are arranged and if it wil be possible to combine them....(such as 10 crossbowmen and 18 spearmen), as you don't need 16 crossbowmen really.....

[almundis]

Now that they are AP and multiple shot you do...

[innerwolf]

Incredible.

Especially that heavy armor with regeneration, for 35 pts

I will never take Oaken Armour again without feeling stupid...

[Dilgar]

Crossbows didn´t get AP?...they only get it through a banner (25pt)?

[unicorn]

Incredible.

Especially that heavy armor with regeneration, for 35 pts

I will never take Oaken Armour again without feeling stupid...

When my friend is facing my sethayla super-mobile army with his infantry Empire, he feels stupid too. Does that meen that WE are uber imba supa and Empire needs to be boosted? Is that good reason to whine about how weak Empire is for him? Does this entitle him to ask empire to be updatet?

[innerwolf]

When my friend is facing my sethayla super-mobile army with his infantry Empire, he feels stupid too. Does that meen that WE are uber imba supa and Empire needs to be boosted? Is that good reason to whine about how weak Empire is for him? Does this entitle him to ask empire to be updatet?

Straw man attack!!
You are talking about an extreme list fighting against an averagely mobile, non-tailored list.
I'm talking about one armour being worse and 15 points more for the shake of "internal balance" and "let's make the newer army the WINZ!1!".

[unicorn]

You are talking about an extreme list fighting against an averagely mobile, non-tailored list.
I'm talking about one armour being worse and 15 points more for the shake of "internal balance" and "let's make the newer army the WINZ!1!".

I am talking about 2 all-commers list facing each other, but that is not important.

About that armor. Yup, sounds crazy. It even is a little crazy. On other hand, on average, well played DE noble will receive much more incoming attacks that good played WE noble:
WE are most the time the charging ones. WE chooses their opponents most the time. WE needs to break in 1st turn of fight most the time.
DE are definitelly not so often the charging ones. DE have much harder time to choose where and who to fight. DE are made to be sort of for hammer-and-anvil army, so they need to spend a lot more time in CC.

Or do you think I am that wrong?