Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

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heerolocke
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by heerolocke »

I'd like to keep:

1. Hail of Doom Arrow
2. Wand of Wych Elm
3. Dawnspear
4. Arcane Bodkins
5. Bow of Loren
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waywatcher*kenobi
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by waywatcher*kenobi »

popisdead wrote: I cannot remember the other items. Acorn of Ages was in the Preview list but we just get free woods now.
I want the Acorn back...when I first started playing years ago that was how I always took out the steamtank..got pretty good at guessing ranges...and then just lob it at the tank and wham! It's now in the middle of woods and takes damage if it moves :sexy:
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Shandrakor »

What I'd like to keep:
  1. Item 1: The Rhymer's Harp
  2. Item 2: Stone of Rebirth
  3. Item 3: Amaranthine Brooch
  4. Item 4: Fimbulwinter Shard
  5. Item 5: Wand of Wych Elm
Tweak
Changed Item: Dawnspear - Change it so it's either cheaper (20-30pts) or more effective (i.e. +1 Strength all the time and Spear effects on top of the -1 to hit thing).

What I think they'll keep...:
Predictions
  1. Item 1: The Spirit Sword
  2. Item 2: Hail of Doom Arrow
  3. Item 3: Royal Standard of Ariel
  4. Item 4: Helm of the Hunt
  5. Item 5: Wand of Wych Elm
Tweak
Changed Item: I doubt that all of the above items will remain as is, but if I had to pick an item I think they'll keep but change, it'd probably be:
[*] Bow of Loren
Well, my ideas for the next book turned out to be a bust.
But it was still fun working on something of this scale.
For those who care:
http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=22620
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Hit In Face »

waywatcher*kenobi wrote:
popisdead wrote: I cannot remember the other items. Acorn of Ages was in the Preview list but we just get free woods now.
I want the Acorn back...when I first started playing years ago that was how I always took out the steamtank..got pretty good at guessing ranges...and then just lob it at the tank and wham! It's now in the middle of woods and takes damage if it moves :sexy:

I need a "like" button for this post! Oh, the good old days...
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by mryam »

What I'd like to keep:
Item 1: Hail of Doom
Item 2: Helm of the Hunt
Item 3: Dawnspear
Item 4: Deepwood Sphere (mostly dependent on Tree Singing
Item 5: Arcane Bodkins

For the tweak I think/hope that Moonstone could be used before movement
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by chickenbane »

I'd keep:
Hail of Doom arrow
Bow of Loren (with the proviso that it has the users strength)
Moonstone
Deepwood Sphere
Helm of the hunt.

I'd tweak the Spirit Sword to allow ward saves for the bearer if he was less than 6" from a wood.
In fact what I'd really like to see is the return of Skrawk the falconer.
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by enkidu714 »

Predictions
  1. Divination Orb
  2. Deepwood Sphere
  3. Wand of Wych Elm
  4. Calaingor's Stave
  5. Moonstone of the Hidden Ways
The reason I left off HoDA is because if units such as Glade Guard should be given Multiple Shots, then that's pretty much the same as HoDA, which makes having HoDA redundant.

Tweak
Gaemrath - the Banner of Midwinter: in addition to all of its current effects, it gives the unit +1 toughness until the start of the next player turn.
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Aemir »

1. Hail of Doom Arrow
2. Amaranthine Brooch
3. Stone of Rebirth
4. Moonstone of Hidden Ways
5. Helm of the Hunt

Tweak:
Bow of Loren - set to 25 points (in case they don't give us shots = number of attacks)
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by FriedTaterExplosion »

enkidu714 wrote:The reason I left off HoDA is because if units such as Glade Guard should be given Multiple Shots, then that's pretty much the same as HoDA, which makes having HoDA redundant.
I find that I use the HoDA often to get rid of pesky ethereal creatures and units. I would hate to lose it due to that. I remember one post here where they proposed making Hail of Doom Arrow part of the lore of Athel Loren- which would be kind of neat to conjure a HoDA which can be used in the subsequent shooting phase.
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by hutobega »

1. Hail of Doom arrow is a must
2. Seed of rebirth (thats the 2+ ward on last wound right)? I love that one
3. Helm of the Hunt
4. If were counting sprites than the + 1 dispell dice one...if not then hmmm Get Hunting spear or bow like equivilent. We deserve a type of Botl thrower :)
5. The -1 to hit in close comabt item (sorry don't have book with me at work)

TWEAK!
Wand of the wych elm... If player uses 3 OR more dice to cast a spell you gain 1 dispell dice and make it a 75point item... Honestly I think that woul be amazing and worth it...But thats me crying for some magic defense again my friend who plays beatmen and bring a herdstone with 3 level 1 jerks lol.
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Shandrakor »

hutobega wrote:TWEAK!
Wand of the wych elm... If player uses 3 OR more dice to cast a spell you gain 1 dispell dice and make it a 75point item... Honestly I think that woul be amazing and worth it...But thats me crying for some magic defense again my friend who plays beatmen and bring a herdstone with 3 level 1 jerks lol.
That's just an upgraded Divination Orb. Probably should just make the Divination Orb 50 points and make it work on 3+ dice instead of only 4+ dice being used to cast. Might be worth using then...
Well, my ideas for the next book turned out to be a bust.
But it was still fun working on something of this scale.
For those who care:
http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=22620
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by hutobega »

Sorry thats what I meant. Forgot which was which Thank you! I meant Divination Orb hahaha.
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Zefiris »

too many to count but my top catagories is:

All the magical arrows (I myself like the starfire arrows)
All the magical bows (all 3 bows have their uses if you toss them on correctly)
All the Seasonal Standards (I like themed armies)
All the Sprites (I like the ranged sprites and spell sprites)
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Baardah »

Predictions:
Bow of Loren
Helm of the hunt
Wand of wych elm
Hail of doom arrow
Blades of loec

I think/wish:

That oaken armor can be made into some special armor as a equivalent of the HE dragon armor or the sea dragon cloaks

I hope the same for arcane Bodkins. That they'd be included in a wood elf armory

There will be a big banner to I think. Probably the royal standard of Ariel, but time will tell if it will be a usefull item of just BS. Lot depends how we can equip a BSB with mundane protection

I also hope talismanic tattoos will reappear as a means to up our defense. If like the tats to give +1 T. Hardly game breaking and would separate from the other elves.... Us being higher T lower armour...
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Findecano »

This is a pretty hard one, but here are my top 3

Bow of Loren
Hail of Doom Arrow
Blades of Loec
Spirit Sword
Banner of Ariel

I'd like to see them make the spirit sword useful instead of removing it, it just seems iconically wood elfy, despite it being virtually unusable in its current incarnation.
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Zefiris »

Findecano wrote:This is a pretty hard one, but here are my top 3

I'd like to see them make the spirit sword useful instead of removing it, it just seems iconically wood elfy, despite it being virtually unusable in its current incarnation.
Personally I think the spirit sword is the perfect monster hunting sword. Being it auto-wounds it gets past their toughness which most monsters defense is from. Being all monsters tend to have 8 and lower leadership, just need to avoid those lord monster riders until last (or keep a Lore of Life mage around).
But if just monster hunting, likely you would have killed it just from the physicals attacks
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by godswearhats »

It's terrible for monster hunting, because the monsters get to use the Ld of their general if within range. Even then, if you roll a 1 and he rolls a 6 you're likely going to die. The only safe monsters to hunt are those with Ld 5 and lower and those are pretty few and far between. If you got to explicitly use the monster's Ld (not the rider, handler or general's) then this would be amazing.

I really want to use this sword, but every time I've put together a list with it, I've changed it to something more practical.
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Zefiris »

godswearhats wrote:It's terrible for monster hunting, because the monsters get to use the Ld of their general if within range. Even then, if you roll a 1 and he rolls a 6 you're likely going to die. The only safe monsters to hunt are those with Ld 5 and lower and those are pretty few and far between. If you got to explicitly use the monster's Ld (not the rider, handler or general's) then this would be amazing.

I really want to use this sword, but every time I've put together a list with it, I've changed it to something more practical.
You don't use the generals, this is not a normal leadership test they will say so if it was (which you roll 2d6 and not 1d6 like the Spirit Sword)
The only thing I think which will affect this is that +1 leadership banner in the Core book and only the magical +1 leadership (and that reroll bonus from the BSB dosent apply either being this isnt a leadership test)

Edit: I consider the Spirit Sword a Characteristic Test instead of a leadership test
Last edited by Zefiris on 17 Jan 2014, 20:44, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Shandrakor »

godswearhats wrote:I really want to use this sword, but every time I've put together a list with it, I've changed it to something more practical.
Yeah, the Spirit Sword needs some reworking to be made useful, especially at its current cost.

If I was going to fix it it'd probably have to be no armor saves (or at least heavily penalized) and have a lesser chance or no chance to wound the wielder. Basically making it cast Spirit Leech from the Lore of Death for every target hit by it would be optimal.
Zefiris wrote:You don't use the generals, this is not a normal leadership test they will say so if it was (which you roll 2d6 and not 1d6 like the Spirit Sword)
The only thing I think which will affect this is that +1 leadership banner in the Core book and only the magical +1 leadership (and that reroll bonus from the BSB dosent apply either being this isnt a leadership test)

Edit: I consider the Spirit Sword a Characteristic Test instead of a leadership test
The General's Leadership isn't just used for Leadership tests in 8th edition. It's just a flat modifier that's applied to any model in range now. You're thinking of previous editions where it was only usable on Leadership tests.
Well, my ideas for the next book turned out to be a bust.
But it was still fun working on something of this scale.
For those who care:
http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=22620
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Zefiris »

Shandrakor wrote:Yeah, the Spirit Sword needs some reworking to be made useful, especially at its current cost.

If I was going to fix it it'd probably have to be no armor saves (or at least heavily penalized) and have a lesser chance or no chance to wound the wielder. Basically making it cast Spirit Leech from the Lore of Death for every target hit by it would be optimal.
Na, that will make the sword too expensive when a magical banner can fix that armor save in a unit of Wildriders.
On a eagle for movement freedom. You might benefit from that reduced armor save but at the cost of the hero defense, and you cant really go against a hero riding on a monster inside a unit.
So my viewpoint is that it is best inside wildriders.
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by godswearhats »

Inspiring Presence says that all units within 12" use the General's Ld not their own. It doesn't say anything about Ld tests. There's an FAQ for the spell Spirit Leech which works pretty much identically to the Spirit Sword and you get to use your General's Ld for that.
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Shandrakor »

godswearhats wrote:Inspiring Presence says that all units within 12" use the General's Ld not their own. It doesn't say anything about Ld tests. There's an FAQ for the spell Spirit Leech which works pretty much identically to the Spirit Sword and you get to use your General's Ld for that.
Right, but Spirit Leech doesn't have any chance of wounding the caster, only the enemy.
Zefiris wrote:Na, that will make the sword too expensive when a magical banner can fix that armor save in a unit of Wildriders.
On a eagle for movement freedom. You might benefit from that reduced armor save but at the cost of the hero defense, and you cant really go against a hero riding on a monster inside a unit.
So my viewpoint is that it is best inside wildriders.
The Razor Banner only modifies armor save by 1. When fighting 1+ Armor Save units that doesn't really help much when even if you auto-wound they will just almost auto-save your auto-wound without a problem, thus never getting a chance to use the Spirit Leech like effect (or doing any damage).

Oh, also, you can't put the Spirit Sword in a unit of Wild Riders on a non-Spellweaver because the only way to put a Highborn in a unit of Wild Riders is with the Wild Rider Kindred which restricts you to choosing magical spears as your only weapon options besides the basic spear you start with.

Edits: To address Zefiris.
Last edited by Shandrakor on 17 Jan 2014, 20:58, edited 2 times in total.
Well, my ideas for the next book turned out to be a bust.
But it was still fun working on something of this scale.
For those who care:
http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=22620
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by godswearhats »

Damn you, Death Magic! :-)
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Zefiris »

Shandrakor wrote:
godswearhats wrote:Inspiring Presence says that all units within 12" use the General's Ld not their own. It doesn't say anything about Ld tests. There's an FAQ for the spell Spirit Leech which works pretty much identically to the Spirit Sword and you get to use your General's Ld for that.
Right, but Spirit Leech doesn't have any chance of wounding the caster, only the enemy.
Zefiris wrote:Na, that will make the sword too expensive when a magical banner can fix that armor save in a unit of Wildriders.
On a eagle for movement freedom. You might benefit from that reduced armor save but at the cost of the hero defense, and you cant really go against a hero riding on a monster inside a unit.
So my viewpoint is that it is best inside wildriders.
The Razor Banner only modifies armor save by 1. When fighting 1+ Armor Save units that doesn't really help much when even if you auto-wound they will just almost auto-save your auto-wound without a problem, thus never getting a chance to use the Spirit Leech like effect (or doing any damage).

Oh, also, you can't put the Spirit Sword in a unit of Wild Riders on a non-Spellweaver because the only way to put a Highborn in a unit of Wild Riders is with the Wild Rider Kindred which restricts you to choosing magical spears as your only weapon options besides the basic spear you start with.

Edits: To address Zefiris.
So only eagle and glade riders? Pooie. Eternal Guard & Glade Guard works too thou, abit slower.
Still be interesting if you bait the monster away from the General's 12 inches or make the general unit flee using arrows/starfire arrows
Well 1+ save on monsters is super hard being normally there is nothing to boost them up like characters. What type of monster has 1+ save anyway?
Still that leadership is a pain unless you have the wraith stone nearby, and say you have that magical leadership banner too (for a net of 2 or more depending on if the target's leadership is lower than 10)
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Re: Top 5 heirlooms to keep?

Post by Shandrakor »

Zefiris wrote:Well 1+ save on monsters is super hard being normally there is nothing to boost them up like characters. What type of monster has 1+ save anyway?
I was more thinking of the much more common Monstrous Cavalry (common 1 or 2+ Armor Saves), as opposed to just raw Monsters, though 3 or 4+ Armor Saves on Monsters/Chariots is fairly common as well and our wimpy Strength 4 Highborns aren't too good at getting through that save even with auto-wounding of the Spirit Sword. That's why I generally default to a Great Weapon for the +2 Strength on Nobles or Highborn.
Well, my ideas for the next book turned out to be a bust.
But it was still fun working on something of this scale.
For those who care:
http://www.asrai.org/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=22620
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